harpdude61
2118 posts
Sep 08, 2014
3:33 PM
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Just a video to show how throat bending works for me. Please, if you can tongue bend on hole one of a low F harp I would love to see it.
Maybe sharing more videos with each other would save a lot of typing and help each other more. I'm not a good video maker, but I'm even worse at getting a message across in print.
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BronzeWailer
1435 posts
Sep 08, 2014
7:37 PM
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Hi Harpdude.
I am not much of a tongue blocker, and haven't really blocked out of the left side of my tongue, until your video inspired me to take up the challenge. I can sort of do it. I am not dropping my jaw that much, the Adam's apple is bobbing up and down, and I am actually thrusting my tongue forward a little. Cheeks are narrowing, I was thinking high soft palate and I was also grimacing a bit :)
Someone more skilled in TB can probably do a better job but this is my two cents' worth.
Cheers!
BronzeWailer's YouTube
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harpdude61
2119 posts
Sep 09, 2014
4:56 AM
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Thanks Bronze Wailer! Glad you added a tongue blocking video. Nice tilt on the harp as well. I, myself am using the lip block tilt embouchure.
Sounds good, I do see that Adam's Apple working when you go to the side view. IMHO you are using the throat and naturally the tongue follows.
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Frank
5239 posts
Sep 09, 2014
5:13 AM
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I will usually switch From TBing to a pucker for the 1 hole bends on low harps :)
Here is an improv on a Low E :)
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The Iceman
2033 posts
Sep 09, 2014
6:04 AM
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As the harmonica key gets lower, the target/reference spots along the roof of the mouth (soft/hard palate) are "rotated down the mouth" - or move deeper into the chamber.
My 1 hole inhale bend on a Low F harmonica has that "lump in the tongue" further down and arcing towards a deeper throat area. The base of the throat is kept open in the "pre yawn attitude".
Great control. Great tone.
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The Iceman
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harpdude61
2120 posts
Sep 09, 2014
6:26 AM
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Very nice Frank!
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mlefree
175 posts
Sep 09, 2014
11:48 AM
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I'm really digging these throat bending discussions. And I'm glad someone is focusing on the difference between bending on the lower tones versus the higher ones. Allow me to try to remove some of the mystery.
The thing that often gets lost in bending discussions is the pure physics of it. Long ago a physicist named Hermann von Helmholtz discovered and quantitated the nature of vibration in (almost) closed chambers. His discovery that the air inside smaller chambers vibrates or resonates at higher frequencies and in larger chambers air resonates at lower frequencies is now known as Helmholtz resonance.
Here is a picture of some Helmholtz resonators.
And a reference for further reading.
Helmhotz Resonance
We've all blown air into a bottle. We all likely also know that doing so over larger bottles evokes lower tones than do smaller ones. But we may not consider that the same Helmholtz resonance plays a huge role in the physics of the instrument we all love. By that I mean that our airways form our resonant chamber in the same way that the body of a guitar does.
We've all heard it said that a harmonica player needs to "tune" the size of his/her oral cavity to the note being played. harpdude61 has just demonstrated a fine example of why that is.
The reason he cannot bend his Low F with just his tongue is that his resonant chamber (his airways) is not big enough to allow that low of a frequency to vibrate (long wavelength). However, when he includes his throat his resonant chamber becomes large enough to allow the longer wavelength sounds to vibrate.
No magic involved. Same thing with tone. The reason harpers are advised to "open wide" and use their "yawn muscles" is that this allows the lower frequencies to resonate, yielding that rich, deep tone we all seek.
Check it out, understand it and use it!
Michelle
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email: mlefree@silverwingleather.com
Last Edited by mlefree on Sep 09, 2014 11:49 AM
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BronzeWailer
1438 posts
Sep 09, 2014
3:58 PM
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Interesting discussion people. Thanks for starting it harpdude.
It's good to experiment and think about how we are making (or trying to make) these sounds.
I am taking everyone's advice, hints, tricks and tips on board.
BronzeWailer's YouTube
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harpdude61
2123 posts
Sep 09, 2014
7:06 PM
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Fantastic post mlefree!!
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Milsson
162 posts
Sep 09, 2014
10:29 PM
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If you toungue block with the "back"/under side of your toungue you can open your mouth more.
I can get the bend but it´s not stable and i could never use it musicaly in fast riffs.
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harpdude61
2126 posts
Sep 10, 2014
8:19 AM
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Milsson..did you say TBing with the bottom side of your tongue. Tip up? Just when I thought I had heard everything...how cool!!
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Milsson
163 posts
Sep 10, 2014
11:48 AM
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Yes exactly. It's hard to open up your mouth/jaw when bending low harps TBing. Lipblocking makes it mutch easier to open wide but blocking with the bottom side(tip up as you said) makes it easier to drop the jaw.
I've played like this on the low hole bends pretty long so i don't realy think about it.
I've heard, but can't remember who?, that a pro player plays the chrom blocking with the bottom side to make it easier with octaves.
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