Philosofy
580 posts
Jul 15, 2014
8:53 AM
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When I try to explain to someone the difference between first and second position, I use "When the Saints Go Marching In." In first position, it has kind of an Old Susanna feel to it, and in second position it has more of a New Orleans jazz feel. People get the idea right away.
Does anyone here have a song or melody that can be played in 1st, 2nd, and 3rd position to highlight the different textures of each position?
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2chops
275 posts
Jul 15, 2014
9:22 AM
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"Joshua Fit the Battle of Jericho" is a good example. I only play it in 2nd & 3rd position. Very different feel for each.
Ron
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I'm workin on it. I'm workin on it.
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Pistolcat
665 posts
Jul 15, 2014
11:36 AM
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All songs can be played that way. But...
Most songs have quite a lot of thirds in them. The third is what's defines the song as minor or major (more or less, right). The major third in first pos is blow 2, blow 5 and blow 8 right? The minor third in first position is OB 1, OB 4 and blow 8 half step bend. Therefore it's hard to play minor songs elsewhere than in the top octave.
Now, third position has the minor third in draw 2 whole step bend, 5 draw and 9 draw. Major third in third position is draw 2 half step bend and blow 9 half step bend. Arguably more accessible than playing minor in first but still cumbersome. To me, at least.
It's easier to modulate between major and minor thirds in second position I think. And that is probably why you play a song in second or third or play a song in first or second.
If you want to try a song In more positions you can try 'Saints' in first second or twelfth and say 'st James infirmary' in second, third and fourth (or fifth).
Or maybe these are just my limitations and other has better ideas :D
Edit: reread the OP. You are not asking 'why' but 'which songs'. Ok. St James as above. Amazing grace in first, second and twelfth. Hit the road jack in second and third.
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Pistolkatt - Pistolkatts youtube
Last Edited by Pistolcat on Jul 15, 2014 11:42 AM
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ridge
532 posts
Jul 15, 2014
12:32 PM
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The head to Cissy Strut in 1st, 2nd and 3rd
It's pretty accessible in 2nd and 3rd... 1st not so much. I'll meditate on another example and get back to you.
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Ridge's YouTube
Last Edited by ridge on Jul 15, 2014 12:34 PM
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timeistight
1614 posts
Jul 15, 2014
12:39 PM
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"Major third in third position is draw 2 half step bend and blow 9 half step bend."
Also hole 5 overblow.
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Pistolcat
667 posts
Jul 15, 2014
12:54 PM
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Ah, yes! Of course! I sort of zoned in on third position's non-oB accessibility. I shan't revise my first post as to let those to come know that the cat with the gun also can err. :)
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Pistolkatt - Pistolkatts youtube
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Martin
675 posts
Jul 16, 2014
4:13 AM
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2chops: `"Joshua Fit the Battle of Jericho" is a good example. I only play it in 2nd & 3rd position.´
Isn´t the reason you only play it in 2nd and 3rd also the reason that it is NOT a good example of a song you can play in 1st. (I, like thousands of others CAN play it in 1st, but it´s rather forced.)
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2chops
276 posts
Jul 16, 2014
4:34 AM
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@Martin...You are spot on. It is forced playing it in 1st. But the main reason I don't play Joshua in 1st is because my 1st position playing is an admitted weak spot.
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I'm workin on it. I'm workin on it.
Last Edited by 2chops on Jul 16, 2014 4:35 AM
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BigBlindRay
232 posts
Jul 17, 2014
8:27 AM
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To transpose the same song into 3 different keys relative to 1st, 2d and 3rd position will only work in a major key - if you do not want to employ the use of Overblows and with limitation.
Any tune that uses the Major pentatonic scale in its core melody can be done in all 3 positions but 3rd position will be restricted purely to the low register
Any other approach is going to be encumbered by the snag of missing a key tone due to overbending
^^EDIT**
Just noticed PistolCat pretty much said the exact same thing earlier with the addition on 1st pos ability to work the Minor pent in the top register. So effectively In transposing a Minor pent melody, 1st pos has a similar restriction set in the top register... bang on.
Last Edited by BigBlindRay on Jul 17, 2014 8:35 AM
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