BigAl
18 posts
Apr 01, 2014
5:52 AM
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I love the sound of small amps, its like a chirping bird from hell tone! Plus they are lighter! I like to use two amps on stage because it solves the volume issue, and gives me a built in back-up if one goes down. Just wondering if any of you do the same and what you use.
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artcarny
8 posts
Apr 01, 2014
6:02 AM
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I'm using 2 vht special 6 combos. One with a line out if I need it. Great setup . I can use one for practice or small venue,both for larger room. They're light and have great tone and plenty of volume.
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rogonzab
536 posts
Apr 01, 2014
6:07 AM
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I like to use 2, but I cant use both on my jam because I dont have a car.
Whit two amps the sounds is bigger and fuller. I dont know if it is much louder.
I use an adapter that cost like a $1. Is just two females jacks in one end, and in the other is a male jack. Is really simple.
I recored this video:
Is a Champ and a Crate V5.
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6SN7
432 posts
Apr 01, 2014
7:55 AM
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I have used dual amps with my 4/5 piece band. I ran them a few different ways: using one amp as a "slave"; using a Y-cable; and running them thru an A/B box. It sounded okay, and yes the amps were easy to carry but it meant carrying a lot of wires and stuff and fiddling with it and fixing certain nits that happen while doing the set.......ugh! I do not consider this a simple alternative to using a large single amp. I love the simplicity of setting up one amp (i don't use pedals) and plugging in and playing. I like the added visceral feel a larger amp (pushing air) that a 8" speaker just doesn't do.
I know many here at the forum use and love their 5 watt amps and have strong arguments why they are the way to go. I could see that if I was in solo/duo or playing with a very "sympathetic" band. But the reality is, unless you are the "ringmaster", its like bringing a pea shooter to a gun fight.
Choosing an amp because it is light and easy to carry is pretty far down on my list on positive attributes.
Last Edited by 6SN7 on Apr 01, 2014 7:57 AM
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BigAl
19 posts
Apr 01, 2014
8:20 AM
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I use a Radial aby box that is passive, so I only need 2 more cables. I always carry spare cables and a spare amp, Its not more bother for me. The radial box alows me to ground lift, transformer isolate, and phase correct with the flip of a few switches, pretty convenient. I am always the sound engineer, the amp setup is simple by comparison! I just won't hire loud players, my ears are first on my list of positive attributes.:) I don't do jams for the same reason, I feel bad for guys that have to put up with loud volume for a musical outlet. I'm just lucky to have a big group of friends that are great players. I also like being able to get my tone without lots of volume.
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Slimharp
302 posts
Apr 01, 2014
8:31 AM
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Im going to get a Memphis Mini. Just wondering if I can run the line out into my 15 watt vintage Gibson GA-30, which has a 12" & 8" speakers for some added volume and fullness. The line out would go into the standard 1/4 input for microphone or guitar. I think this would be an ideal set up for small to medium size gigs. I wouldnt have to drag out the Bassman and in those settings turn the Bassman down instead of turning up the 2 smaller amps and getting some drive and crunch.
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rogonzab
537 posts
Apr 01, 2014
8:43 AM
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Slimharp,
they are two diferent things.
1) Use the MM LO into the Gibson = you get the sound of the MM into the Gibson.
2) Use a pasive splitter = you plug your mic (and pedals) into the pasive splitter and then you send your sound into the MM and into the Gibson, and you get the tone from both.
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Slimharp
304 posts
Apr 01, 2014
8:57 AM
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OK, thanks rogonzab.
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Greg Heumann
2666 posts
Apr 01, 2014
9:33 AM
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Here are 5 ways you can connect your mic to 2 amps:
- Y Cable
- Passive ABY Box
- Active ABY Box
- Line Out from amp 1 to Input 1 of Amp 2
- Input 2 of Amp 1 to Input 1 of Amp 2
Note that solutions 1, 2 and 5 electrically parallel the amp's input impedances, with #5 likely adding even more load. Although this can be fine with dynamic/CR/CM elements where it will only rob a little output and tone - it can really hit a crystal or ceramic mic hard. For those mics, solutions 3 or 4 are preferable. Solution 4 can add an extra gain stage to the mix and may make the system a bit more feedback-prone.
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***************************************************
/Greg
BlowsMeAway Productions
See my Customer Mics album on Facebook
BlueState - my band
Bluestate on iTunes
Last Edited by Greg Heumann on Apr 01, 2014 9:36 AM
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rogonzab
538 posts
Apr 01, 2014
9:45 AM
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Thxs Greg!!
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BigAl
20 posts
Apr 01, 2014
9:45 AM
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Good advice Greg. I only use dynamic mics, my ulitmate 545 is my favorite. I agree I don't hear a lot of difference with my box. I guess i don't think much about it since I quit playing the bullet micc.
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Barley Nectar
341 posts
Apr 01, 2014
10:13 AM
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I agree with the second part of 6SN7's post.
Played a two amp gig last Saturday night. This was with two excellent fellows on flat tops. No drums/bass. We did light rock and used Fisher column PA and a couple of monitors. Medium size, hard room with about 50 people. My amps were not miced.
I ran a 16W 1x10 home built amp and a 6W SE Newcomb with a 6x9 speaker. These were driven thru an Arion SAD-1 stereo delay. (excellent harp pedal) The Newcomb took care of the echo/slapback. This rig was lush and thick with plenty of volume in this situation. I feel that using the Arion is a key to getting a wide verity of tones from a two amp rig. I have also used this setup with a 30W Sano and a souped up VC for echo.
Using a stereo pedal is another way to drive two amps. You can also use a pedal between the line out of your first amp to drive a dedicated "wet" second amp. Lots of options when you think about it...BN
Last Edited by Barley Nectar on Apr 01, 2014 10:14 AM
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GamblersHand
500 posts
Apr 01, 2014
10:25 AM
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I run a Marble Max with it's line out into a VHT Special 6. I've tried a Y-splitter but I prefer this sound, and doesn't appreciably increase feedback
Occasional bigger pub rock gigs I'll mic one of the amps to the PA
Probably the best amplified sound I've had - though unfortunately I didn't get to gig with it - was playing the Max with an HG2. They both have such different characters you could really dial in the right sound for the room, accompaniment etc
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boris_plotnikov
944 posts
Apr 01, 2014
10:36 AM
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If gig is too loud (e.g. pair of electric guitars in a band) I often use 2 amps, splitting my tone using my Boss RC30 looper.
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Excuse my bad English.
My videos.
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BigAl
21 posts
Apr 01, 2014
6:14 PM
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Barley, I often do the same thing with a stereo reverb pedal.
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Slimharp
305 posts
Apr 02, 2014
10:03 AM
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Thanks Greg. I have an R7, CM, CR and Ceramic so I will have chices on how to set it up. Very valuable info.
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Bryan A
24 posts
Dec 11, 2014
12:55 PM
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@ Greg, so if I'm using option 4 (line out of my MM into my combo amp (bedrock 25 watt amp)what settings on the bedrock would be most likely to re-produce the MM tone into the bedrock speaker. I really just want to utilize the 12" speaker, but at the moment it's just not sounding like the MM. Turned down the treble, mids, and base, then turned them up...sounds chimey or bright with both, MM sounds way better by itself. Using your 545, which is friggin awesome by the way!! Thanks for any tips you or anyone else may have
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barbequebob
2788 posts
Dec 11, 2014
1:07 PM
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I've rarely had to do two amps but when I did, I was seriously old school with some old Fender tube amps where I was plugged into the #1 input in one amp and then from the one amp, I plugged a guitar cable into the #2 input and then then other end of the cable was plugged into the #1 input of the 2nd amp. Always worked like a charm.
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
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LSC
696 posts
Dec 11, 2014
3:52 PM
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To carry the phrase "Peashooter to a gun fight" to another level, I'd really love to hear Greg's two SJ Avenger set up. Two cannons to anything short of nuclear war. I personally waiting for the day I can bring my Avenger and hook it up to my Cruncher. I might even go all out and add the bigger transformer that came with the Cruncher to upgrade it to a Super. Power! More power I say!
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LSC
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KCBLUES
72 posts
Dec 11, 2014
4:41 PM
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I was going to post this in the FOR SALE section but it is relevant to this thread.
I am unloading a seldom used BUFFERED "Y" SPLIITER...
It is from JHS pedals - a boutique pedal builder in KC
It works great with no "tone" drain... I just keep playing through the PA and don't really use it...
It requires a 9 V adapter (which I will include)
I paid 100 bucks for them and want to unload them for 75 dollars...
here is the link...
https://www.jhspedals.com/products/guitar-pedals/buffered-splitter/
email me at kurtcrandall -at- yahoo (dot) com
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Pockets
65 posts
Dec 11, 2014
4:46 PM
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I have heard good things about the twin city, if you have a pedal board setup. Have not tried one yet though.
http://www.tonebone.com/twincity.php
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garry
548 posts
Dec 11, 2014
7:07 PM
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I've done this with a Y connector, and while I like the sound, I'm not convinced it gives much more volume. An SPL meter shows about the same. This feels unintuitive to me, but so does the logarithmic response curve, so I'm not sure if it should make a difference or not. Doubling the amps in effect doubles the power, which should yield 3db increase. But it also doubles the speaker area, and I'm not clear how that relates.
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Greg Heumann
2907 posts
Dec 11, 2014
7:45 PM
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@LSC - Even I have never tried that. It scares me!
I just found out about a GREAT solution from Lone Wolf. THIS is a treaty way to go - it is like "3" in my examples above but without the ability to switch. Simple but effective and very high input impedance, great for crystals. Check out The Terminator from Lone Wolf Blues Co.
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***************************************************
/Greg
BlowsMeAway Productions
See my Customer Mics album on Facebook
Bluestate on iTunes
Last Edited by Greg Heumann on Dec 11, 2014 7:46 PM
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JTThirty
259 posts
Dec 12, 2014
5:08 AM
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Greg's posted the perfect solution. I bought the Terminator just in time for an outdoor gig so I could use my Kalamazoo I and also go through the p.a. It worked substantially well. It fattened my crystal mic's tone through the amp and sounded great through the p.a. I ran a Lone Wolf Delay through the amp and a Lone Wolf Harp Break through the p.a. Works as advertised.
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Ricky B
http://www.bushdogblues.blogspot.com
RIVER BOTTOM BLUES--crime novel for blues fans available at Amazon/B&N and my blog
THE DEVIL'S BLUES--ditto
HOWLING MOUNTAIN BLUES--due out early 2015
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arnenym
328 posts
Dec 12, 2014
6:53 AM
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+ 1 on you Greg.
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NathanLWBC
27 posts
Dec 12, 2014
9:05 AM
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Thanks, Greg. The initial demand for the Terminator has been way more than anticipated. We were really trying to address the tone loss of crystal mics, and we thought the splitter function would be a good tool to include.
@JTThirty...I'm glad you enjoy the pedal, and I'm glad that you used it to achieve a really creative setup/sound.
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--Nathan Heck
Lead Technician, Lone Wolf Blues Co.
customerservice@lonewolfblues.com
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Little roger
47 posts
Dec 12, 2014
10:02 AM
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Nathan, Could you explain what the terminator actually does? I understand the splitter function of course, but what is this fet buffer etc? What does it do to a crystal or cm mic? Thanks
Roger
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NathanLWBC
28 posts
Dec 12, 2014
10:14 AM
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Sorry OP for getting OT...
The Terminator is an active FET buffer and isolated splitter with a 10 meg ohm input. The 10 meg impedance is ideal for crystal microphone elements and more than adequate for controlled magnetic elements. Good effect pedals will have a true bypass and with a true bypass you will lose the impedance match that the pedal provides causing the tone to be a little thinner, just like playing with no effect pedals at all. The Terminator will prevent this tone loss while in bypass by always providing an optimum impedance match for your microphone.
I copied and pasted that from Randy's description...in simpler terms, it makes your sound fatter. Improper input impedance robs mics, most noticeably crystals, of their fullness.
We had multiple customers tell us their vintage mics sounded fantastic with our pedals engaged, but lost the "fullness" or "bottom" when they bypassed our pedals. So, we decided to create a dedicated buffer.
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--Nathan Heck
Lead Technician, Lone Wolf Blues Co.
customerservice@lonewolfblues.com
Last Edited by NathanLWBC on Dec 12, 2014 10:16 AM
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mrdon46
92 posts
Feb 03, 2015
8:36 PM
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I love playing through 2 amps--and carrying 2 small amps vs 1 big one. The Terminator sounds like a great solution--if I understand it correctly, not dissimilar to what I came up with--a Jayphat with 2 outputs, transformer isolated to prevent ground loops. One amp dry, the other with effects, sounds great.
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Harpaholic
596 posts
Feb 03, 2015
8:46 PM
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garry when you use a Y splitter you cut the signal in half so each amp is only getting 50% of your normal signal. So no if won't be much louder.
The Passive Radial ABY is a great pedal, highly recommend.
No need to get Radial active ABY pedal.
I watched the video, and I hate to say it, but I like the tone better without the pedal. I did hear the added bass with the pedal but other frequencies sounded muted. Granted its a video, and it may not be doing the pedal justice.
Am I crazy?
Last Edited by Harpaholic on Feb 03, 2015 10:11 PM
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doctom
21 posts
Feb 04, 2015
3:09 PM
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Hey Guys,
Sorry if this is a little OT but would you retain the amped tone if you lined out to a PA.
I like the tone of my VHT Sp6 but haven't tried lining it out to a PA yet and don't want to find out the hard way if the sound is gonna suck.
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indigo
55 posts
Feb 04, 2015
4:42 PM
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Two pertinent things re doing this.One is that you lose the 'tone' of the amps own speaker..this match may be what attracts you to the sound of it.
Then there's the PA itself,in my experience sometimes the line in works fine and in other rigs it can be a bit'mushy' or boomy.
Horn speakers seem to be the worse for some reason.
All the above can be ameliorated to some extent if you know the sound guy but if you are plugging into an unknown PA it can be a bit of a crapshoot.
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