JustFuya
3 posts
Feb 21, 2014
4:35 PM
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I'd seen this video before. I was most impressed by his energy and his connection with the crowd. It would be nice to see video of his playing earlier in the show. In a finale I don't see the harm in unloading all the extra riffs that have accumulated during the show. It makes for lighter baggage on the trip home.
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Frank
3877 posts
Feb 21, 2014
5:32 PM
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For the sake of discussion lets say that what he did was in fact some truly Amazing blues harpin...Now what? - It seems like now a days there are so many Amazing players - he'd of probably gotten less attention here and the thread would be dead and gone already? So his playing being average was to his advantage it seems in this scenario
...
Last Edited by Frank on Feb 21, 2014 5:35 PM
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bonedog569
903 posts
Feb 21, 2014
5:34 PM
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I don't really like to go nasty** - but It was bullshit - to summarize all I agree with about what Wolf innumerates above (thank you). The same kind of crap 'rock star' bass and guitar players do with the harp when they take it out- only more so. He is what I'd consider an advanced beginner who's faking it - both to himself as well as the audience. He's not faking the energy or enthusiasm - just his ability to play harp. But hey - he's playing to bigger audiences than I am.
**
I guess I get prickly when I feel like this little instrument is demeaned.
Playing it like this - in public- demeans it IMO. Some of the audience might enjoy the display but it will make musicians of all stripes wary of letting harp players come up onstage, - with good reason unfortunately.
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Last Edited by bonedog569 on Feb 21, 2014 5:43 PM
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laurent2015
604 posts
Feb 21, 2014
6:34 PM
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I cannot play 30% of what he performs, so who am I to
be tough with him?
Everybody understands he achieves a good show-off (by the way, Blue Shaddy, that's the name of the band, includes a fabulous guitarist who's Graham's brother).
The issue is: I watched many vids of them playing, and I can assure you that Graham's always playing the same licks or riffs, especially using trills.
I think that the show-off is the entire range of what he can do (and yet, it's a lot) and contents several patterns that he uses on stage; my opinion is that it is a working formula, related to their music.Graham's also jumping and twitching on stage: nothing but normal, coz the band is australian, and there are kangaroos over there...
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SteamrollinStan
123 posts
Feb 21, 2014
7:20 PM
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Oh well he's up there doin it, I do this crap all the time in my mancave, wish I knew what I now know 40 years ago, but you see this all the time at blues festivals and the audience wouldnt know wtf was going on. And he's going hard on an F harp which can scream easy IMHO.
Last Edited by SteamrollinStan on Feb 21, 2014 7:21 PM
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jpmcbride
26 posts
Feb 21, 2014
7:40 PM
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Adam's comment's about the harmonica are spot on. This little instrument is easy to play badly. By that I mean its easy for someone to pick it up and quickly play well enough to get in front of an audience and play, but still be pretty bad. And because of this, people have come to expect, and even like, badly played harmonica. Those of us that know better can't help but be offended by this at times. On the other hand, isn't it the simplicity of this little instrument that drew us to it in the first place?
So when I see a player play something that I know is not that good and its described as "amazing" or "best harmonica solo ever" or "worlds best harmonica player", my first reaction is to be offended and want to tell the poster about all the players I know that are much better. But then I stop and remember that the guy playing the "best harmonica solo ever" is entertaining an audience who is enjoying what he's doing. And anything that puts more harmonica out to the world is a good thing in my opinion.
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Jim McBride
www.bottleoblues.com
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CarlA
460 posts
Feb 21, 2014
8:17 PM
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Wow! The harmonica elitism is rife on this forum.
The irony of it all is that this guy appears to be playing in packed arenas. Most of our modern harmonica pros that are held on a pedestal are lucky to book a gig playing in front of a crowd of 50 at the "Ole' Cajun south-side Louisiana creol cafe" making $50 bucks after a 4 hour set
;)
Last Edited by CarlA on Feb 21, 2014 8:18 PM
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laurent2015
606 posts
Feb 21, 2014
8:36 PM
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Tough post!
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Leatherlips
231 posts
Feb 21, 2014
9:42 PM
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'Amazing'. well not for me. I acknowledge the guy for just being out there and doing what comes naturally to him.
The clip of Senior Wells falls short for me too. I used to learn quite a few of his licks way back, but it's not improved in this rendition.
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Rubes
810 posts
Feb 22, 2014
12:55 AM
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I can tell u guys this........I'm Australian...and I had not heard of them b4.........
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Old Man Rubes at Reverbnation
Dads in Space at Reverbnation
Benny and Rubes at Reverbnation
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MalG
4 posts
Feb 22, 2014
1:34 AM
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…all done & said he's an Aussie (go you good thing!) playing hard & fast at the Gympie Music Muster. In surfing terms I'd call it an 'expression session'. Parts of it I Iike - the fast clean country / bluegrass train. Great to have that speed of breath…plenty of exercise for the 'ol diaphragm. Parts of it I didn't…too repetitious, too quick and too muddled. But hey that's how I feel and that's what shapes my playing. The Iceman…I'm partial to Norton Buffalo so check out 'Big Jake' and 'Shake Your Moneymaker' on the Travellin' Tracks album with Roy Rogers. kudzurunner…nice post & spirited feedback.
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SoulSurfer
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Pistolcat
594 posts
Feb 22, 2014
2:38 AM
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I think it was good. I wouldn't call it blues, though. Some kind of country. I bet the band had been getting super good response and connection with the audience all night. I bet they had a nice empathy bond that allowed them all to just pour it out, connect through the audience's ears, through and past their brains to their soul.
Five minutes of a whole concert viewed through a screen is what I would call "out of context".
Bad labelling, too. But that's how you get hits on YT.
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Pistolkatt - Pistolkatts youtube
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wolfkristiansen
263 posts
Feb 22, 2014
3:08 PM
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He's the Big Bad Wolf?
I'll huff and I'll puff
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jnorem
38 posts
Feb 22, 2014
5:15 PM
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About the Junior Wells clip…does anyone here think that's good harp playing? I don't.
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didjcripey
710 posts
Feb 22, 2014
5:43 PM
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@jnorem re J Wells: its all about the mojo.
Perhaps a lot of us guys could play rings around him; would we compare?
I don't think so.
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Lucky Lester
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jnorem
39 posts
Feb 22, 2014
7:04 PM
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didjcripey : "@jnorem re J Wells: its all about the mojo.
Perhaps a lot of us guys could play rings around him; would we compare?
I don't think so."
Define mojo.
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Call me J
Last Edited by jnorem on Feb 22, 2014 7:54 PM
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Joe_L
2427 posts
Feb 22, 2014
9:04 PM
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That was nothing more than soulless wanking.
Re: Junior Wells. People may find his playing rudimentary and simple. They talk all sorts of shit about him, but I never hear anyone that can approach his execution. He has a degree of soul, tone and technique that most people cant reach. He wrote some fabulous tunes. Not just harmonica songs. He had a huge recorded legacy of classic songs. He wrote classic songs that people perform each and every day. Hell, he replaced Little Walter in the Muddy Waters band, but that doesn't count for much when guys like Big Walter, Cotton, and George Smith were around. Muddy picked Junior.
He influenced an entire generation of musicians, not just a bunch of harp players. Hoodoo Man Blues is considered by many to be a desert island disc. His recordings on the United and States labels are considered classic recordings.
Junior also demonstrated his shitty playing on Give Me One Reason on the Grammys. That happened because he sucked ass and his legacy was meaningless.
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The Blues Photo Gallery
Last Edited by Joe_L on Feb 22, 2014 9:05 PM
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jnorem
40 posts
Feb 22, 2014
9:39 PM
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Joe_L : "Re: Junior Wells. People may find his playing rudimentary and simple. They talk all sorts of shit about him, but I never hear anyone that can approach his execution."
I don't know what people say about his playing.
I said that his playing on that clip wasn't good. Do you think it was good, good harmonica playing? If so, please explain why.
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Call me J
Last Edited by jnorem on Feb 22, 2014 9:40 PM
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Goldbrick
308 posts
Feb 22, 2014
9:51 PM
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Here is a better Junior clip-Junior kicks ass imho-thats mojo
Last Edited by Goldbrick on Feb 22, 2014 9:53 PM
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jnorem
41 posts
Feb 22, 2014
10:10 PM
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Yes, and I'll bet I could post clips of him playing even better than that. He was no Walter Jacobs but he could play alright.
My issue is with people trying to defend the messy, lousy playing he was doing on that first clip. That I don't understand.
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Call me J
Last Edited by jnorem on Feb 22, 2014 10:11 PM
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Joe_L
2428 posts
Feb 22, 2014
10:11 PM
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First of all, Junior wasn't merely a harmonica player. He was a musical legend. He was the total package. Singer, songwriter, entertainer and harp player. On that particular tune, it's not merely a harp tune. It's a song which he chose to play a small amount of harp. If you don't think Junior was capable of playing the harp, listen to his recorded legacy. There is plenty of harmonica there. Give Me One Reason wasn't the only tune that he ever recorded. If you don't dig that tune, look deeper into his musical catalog. If you don't get it, that's okay.
On Give Me One Reason, it's not about the harp playing. What he did on that tune was executed well. It was controlled. It was toneful.
Junior could perform an entire evening worth of soulful, heavy hitting music without ever pulling out a harmonica. He was very deep. To me, that's much more important than going womp, womp, womp on a harp all night long. If you're going to play music, it's far more important to say something meaningful, than to merely wank away.
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The Blues Photo Gallery
Last Edited by Joe_L on Feb 22, 2014 10:13 PM
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Shaganappi
92 posts
Feb 22, 2014
10:22 PM
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Hate to wade into this love fest but I see Graham's main failing to be that he was lucky to get a lot of attention on stage in front of an easy (maybe primed) audience whereas many better players don’t get that chance ever. Gotta wonder if a local guy that we knew would get half these comments. Yup, he has a way to go before he will be labelled as a great harp player but it is a reasonable start. Wish I could pull off what he did although I would hope I would be less theatrical for sure. Do wish he left more space and got some more structure and melody in his solo but it was more a country fox chase than anything so to show off which did work for the audience - so yeah …
As to Blue Shaddy's other stuff, it does not seem to be really harmonica orientated on what I checked so I suspect Graham is a bit new at this to some degree. Is high energy country blues or something like that - basically heavy on the guitars. The following are a couple samples that I noticed with some harp. Not nearly the same as what was featured here. I kinda like some of it.
http://www.blueshaddy.com/music/mp3/Walk%20a%20Mile/Blue%20Shaddy%20-%20Lost%20-%20intro.mp3
http://www.blueshaddy.com/music/mp3/Walk%20a%20Mile/Blue%20Shaddy%20-%20Its%20Gonna%20Be%20Alright%20-%20intro.mp3
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jnorem
42 posts
Feb 22, 2014
10:32 PM
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I've got plenty of Junior Wells recordings because I have a hell of a lot of blues recordings, so don't presume to educate me about the man.
It's okay to criticize Junior Wells, you know. He's no sacred cow, except maybe to those who think that sunglasses and a black fedora give them an air of authenticity.
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Joe_L
2429 posts
Feb 22, 2014
10:35 PM
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Well, then clearly you're a brother of discerning taste. I'll add nothing further.
Junior isn't a sacred cow. He's an American musical legend.
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The Blues Photo Gallery
Last Edited by Joe_L on Feb 22, 2014 10:36 PM
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nacoran
7553 posts
Feb 22, 2014
10:42 PM
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CarlA, Britney Spears has played to packed arenas.
He hit his notes cleanly and fast, but there isn't much sense of song there. I wouldn't sing, 'Oops, I did it again' either (which at least, has a good hook). Yes, maybe people are piling on a bit, but part of good playing is developing your ear. Could you whistle the hook from this? It's notes in a key. Yes, they are cleanly and quickly played, but he's noodling around going nowhere. Compare this to this-
or this-
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Nate
Facebook
Thread Organizer (A list of all sorts of useful threads)
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didjcripey
711 posts
Feb 23, 2014
2:54 AM
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@jnorem: 'define mojo'
if you need a definition, you probably won't get it.
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Lucky Lester
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Stevelegh
933 posts
Feb 23, 2014
6:36 AM
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I've arrived a little late to the party here. I did watch the vid from start to finish as instructed. I found it musically violent and jarring with a highly effected physical display not seen since the spandex wearing metal guitarists of the 80's.
That said, its more theatre than music, which is what it apppears the crowd wanted to see.
The public at large have little reference to what constitutes good or bad harmonica playing because there's always a singer or guitarist who can whip one out of their back pocket and squirt out a few notes. That becomes the listener's frame of reference.
Not that I can complain too much as I picked up the harmonica after hearing the harmonica player on the album Rattle And Hum (not Adam, I mean Bono). I thought he was great and it was far worse than this...
Last Edited by Stevelegh on Feb 23, 2014 6:37 AM
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The Iceman
1476 posts
Feb 23, 2014
8:57 AM
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I like these "controversial" postings/comments regarding talent/technique/effect on a crowd.
No denying this solo is crowd effective. That's one aspect of performance.
However, many on this list are not part of that "crowd mentality", as we listen "inside" the solo. Some of us look for certain aspects of creativity that resonates within us while considering the "crowd pleasing" aspects to be not as important.
I'm one of those. Many "crowd pleasing" moments are, to me, nothing more than some guy that woodsheds for hours playing a simple rhythm or sequence faster and faster and faster.
I consider these good technicians, but fail to see the depth of artistry behind the notes chosen to tickle my own personal sensibility.
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The Iceman
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Frank101
2 posts
Feb 23, 2014
2:54 PM
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Wonder what Rick Estrin would say?
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Frank
3891 posts
Feb 23, 2014
3:11 PM
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Frank101
3 posts
Feb 23, 2014
7:15 PM
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Exactamundo!
He's also real big on the "show" aspect. There's a bit on his video where he demonstrates the MTSID principle - e.g., play draw 2/bend 2/draw 2, hold harp off to side, shake head - audience thinks "Man, This Shit Is Deep!"
That's entertainment!
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Frank
3894 posts
Feb 23, 2014
7:25 PM
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walterharp
1326 posts
Feb 23, 2014
8:05 PM
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My thought about many of the comments here are that if you want to become a better harp player, you note what you do or do not like about what somebody plays and then act on that. It does not make you a better harp player to state in public what you do not like about somebody else's playing. If you have a very high opinion of yourself, then you might think running down another player can somehow teach others what is good or bad. It might make you a better harp player if you ask someone else and they give you an honest opinion. That was the point of Ted's post about Musselwhite.. but he ASKED for it. To be fair, Adam asked for your honest opinions, and you all gave them. Still, I think there is more to be gained by pointing out the good to others than stating obvious weaknesses. It leaves the world a better place, and perhaps makes the individual a better person and better player if they stress the positive instead of the negative. Just my opinion.
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Frank
3897 posts
Feb 24, 2014
5:03 AM
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Ac-Cent-Tchu-Ate The Positive
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harpdude61
1974 posts
Feb 24, 2014
6:08 AM
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I like the OP's video. If you play harmonica in anything besides a pure blues band playing for a pure blues audience this stuff goes over great.
I promise if he can do this he can play a variety of stuff.
People come up after performances like this and tell him he is the best EVER! He probably gets laid if he wants to.
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Stevelegh
937 posts
Feb 24, 2014
7:05 AM
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@Walterharp:
Whilst I think I understand where you're coming from in suggesting that criticising another harp player doesn't make you better, I'm inclined to disagree. Negative criticism can be equally constructive and misplaced positive comments can be equally destructive. The guy in the vid is under no illlusions as to what he was bringing to the table, which was a highly energetic performance that would bring a crowd to their feet and he did a great job. He wouldn't stand on stage at SPAH and try to pull an act like that and if he thinks he can, it will only be because people have blown smoke up his arse.
What I've taken from this is that the art of music is performance, technicality, charisma, theatre, magic, smoke and mirrors and so on. We were asked to comment on a performance where pretty much everyone here knew the magician's tricks which left us critiquing his technique more than his delivery. He did deliver for sure, as the cheering crowd testifies but not on the basis of technique.
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CarlA
461 posts
Feb 24, 2014
7:53 AM
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It would be interesting to see if anyone can reproduce(or better) this performance. While it may rely on rudimentary techniques, I can most assuredly say that most all the naysayers would have a difficult(if not even able to) time to reproduce this version.
Ps. While Adam did mention in the OP for peoples opinions, it is more the vitriolic comments by some members directed as an ad hominum attack on Graham that seem unfair and unnecessary. If you could do better, simply supply the proof.
Last Edited by CarlA on Feb 24, 2014 7:57 AM
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The Iceman
1478 posts
Feb 24, 2014
8:01 AM
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I know of one professional "technician" that could reproduce this performance, as that is what he does best...
That would be RJ Harman.
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The Iceman
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DoubleJ
36 posts
Feb 24, 2014
7:27 PM
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Huey Lewis does something similar in his shows with more taste and maturity.
This guy has lots of talent, heart and imagination. He manages to keep the audience most of the time which is not easy when playing alone for a long period of time.
If he were my student, I'd be bragging about him.
Last Edited by DoubleJ on Feb 24, 2014 7:28 PM
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Destin
66 posts
Feb 24, 2014
9:46 PM
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I liked the fast run coming down from the high end sounded like some classical/bluegrass stuff.
Thats about it, but it is definitely a crowd pleaser.
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joek18
36 posts
Feb 25, 2014
6:52 AM
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In theater, a display of skill - dancing, singing, etc. - is crafted into the character, story and then larger themes of the work. Displays of skill in theater are practiced thousands of times both to increase skill but also to demonstrate the apparent ease the performer has gained, mastery over the craft. Solos in music should come from the same motives.
The only thing that saves this performance from complete and sheer embarrassment is the performer's obvious enthusiasm. He works very hard to show the audience how hard he's working. Charlie McCoy is ten times the player with one-tenth the histrionics.
If I were directing this player, I'd cut the solo in half and limit his movement by 80%. He'd be much better for the discipline.
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harpfox
29 posts
Feb 25, 2014
7:07 AM
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not great lol but for all his technical limitation,he does have that crazed unrestricted expression. Something most of wish we still had after years of disciplining....
also, there's lots of variation in one solo, which is cool. add good technique and your there!
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Tuckster
1397 posts
Feb 25, 2014
8:29 AM
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I don't mind some showmanship as long as it's backed by "musicality". Estrin is a good example.
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groyster1
2550 posts
Feb 25, 2014
8:53 AM
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he has a great,lively and speedy tempo....but it seemed redundant otherwise....and I agree with duke...jr wells did not play "wasted notes"...he played less but made them all quality....this guy did not do that
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groyster1
2551 posts
Feb 25, 2014
8:56 AM
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and yes Joe L...you said it all about jr wells....loved jr...only saw him once live with the all stars....awesome
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Udderkuz03
40 posts
Feb 25, 2014
8:57 AM
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There's only onething that I can think of-Bet he stayed dizzy for a month....
Last Edited by Udderkuz03 on Feb 25, 2014 10:36 AM
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Honkin On Bobo
1180 posts
Feb 25, 2014
9:48 AM
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In reading through this thread, a weird thought just dawned on me.
Is Frank101 just another one of Frank's MBH forum accounts, opened so that Frank can have a conversation with himself?????
Hmmmm..........
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Honkin On Bobo
1181 posts
Feb 25, 2014
10:07 AM
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Oh yeah, the original post.
The only negative for me was it's length. I used to dig the long solo back in my swingin' rock and roll days in the 70s. Not any more....and that goes for guitar, drums, keyboards or any other instrument. A nice little break sure, 4 minutes? Nah. (hell, the holy grail of harp solos whammer jammer only clocked in at a little over 2 min.) Don't dig it at all anymore. Not quite sure why. But I don't. As far as his tone, technique etc. it was fine by me, well except for right near the end I thought he got a ittle sloppy, but I think that was intentional.
Last Edited by Honkin On Bobo on Feb 25, 2014 10:35 AM
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Goldbrick
313 posts
Feb 25, 2014
4:09 PM
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so a missionary is in the jungle and all day all night for a week he hears wild drumming. Its driving him crazy so he asks the chief what is happening .
The chief says drums good-very bad thing happens when drums stop. The missionary cant imagine anything worse and keeps bugging the chief for an answer.
Finally the chief says -very bad thing happens when drums stop--bass solo begins.
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rogonzab
478 posts
Feb 26, 2014
3:12 PM
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+1 on that.
The most imprtatn thing that I had learned is that if the people are dancing everything is OK.
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