John95683
82 posts
Jul 18, 2013
8:46 AM
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A few questions about the new Delta Sonic amp from Mission:
1. An upgrade to 20 watts is $49 extra. Does that make the amp appreciably louder?
2. Standard is cathode bias and adjustable fixed bias is $30 extra. What is the difference between the two, and what effect does the difference have on tone?
3. A "sonic booster" is available for an extra $39.99. What does this do, and is it worth it?
In general, what effect do the above options have on tone and volume, and which options are worth the extra money?
Thanks for your help.
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Rick Davis
2124 posts
Jul 18, 2013
9:28 AM
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John, my quick answer is "I'm not sure." I've sent your post to Bruce Collins and I'll relay the info here when he replies.
But let me take a stab at it:
1- I believe this is larger transformers. I know he designed the chassis so that it could accept transformers used in the 22-watt Deluxe Reverb amp.
2- The amp you have heard in videos with Nic Clark playing is my cathode biased amp. Cathode bias sounds a bit more vintage, saggier, depending on how you play it might sound crunchier. Fixed bias is punchier, stiffer, and might have the perception that it is louder. It sounds more "forward." At least those are the differences I hear between the two.
3- The "Sonic Booster" is probably 3-way mini-toggle switch that changes the gain on the input channel to accommodate different mics.
Is 20 watts appreciably louder than 15 watts? Maybe. If the bigger transformers were combined with the fixed bias I think it would seem quite a bit louder, like a Deluxe Reverb. But remember, the amp has a line out, so it can gig on pretty much any stage.
I think the biasing will have the biggest effect on tone, all other things being equal. I have not played the amp with the bigger transformers but I'm thinking it will boost the low end a bit. Both of these would be subtle, though. It will still be the same amp.
Which are worth the extra money? All of them, or none of them. Get them all and you would have a monstrous little amp for under $990. Get none of them and you still have a monstrous little amp for under $870.
If you play with a variety of different mics I would suggest #3 is a good idea.
**UPDATE**- I heard back from Bruce and I got the three features right. He also agrees that #3 is probably the best optional feature. It is more complex than I described, but I can't give the details because it may be proprietary info. Amp builders don't want their little trade secrets shared.
One interesting note: Bruce thinks you get slightly more crunch from fixed bias, I think you do with cathode bias. As I said, it is subtle and it depends on the way you play.
But Remember!!!! -- I have the original cathode bias amp with NONE of the extra features and I think it is awesome. You could order the basic amp and be in blues harp heaven.
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-Little Rick Davis
The Blues Harp Amps Blog
The Mile High Blues Society
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Last Edited by Rick Davis on Jul 18, 2013 11:22 AM
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Rick Davis
2125 posts
Jul 18, 2013
11:28 AM
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Here is Bruce's explanation of the bias question:
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Cathode biasing reduces the absolute output power by about 20%-25% but it has a greasier, vintage tone and overdrive that is wonderful. While the cooler running, fixed bias setting allows the amp to make the most amount of absolute clean output power, I believe they are more feedback resistant and a bit more crunchy.
Fixed bias amps can also have a little more aggressive punch to them because more of the high voltage power is now across the power tube's plates instead of their cathodes.
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-Little Rick Davis
The Blues Harp Amps Blog
The Mile High Blues Society
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6SN7
334 posts
Jul 18, 2013
6:18 PM
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Bruce Collins is a very approachable guy, very knowledgeable and you should call him directly and ask these questions. While RD is very informed, why settle for him telling what "God" whispers in his ear when you can call "God" direct and hear it for yourself.
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Rick Davis
2130 posts
Jul 18, 2013
7:31 PM
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Yep, Bruce loves to talk amps. Give him a call. I try to answer question that come up here because I don't think he visits this site. I've never seen him post here. He doesn't really have time for it.
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-Little Rick Davis
The Blues Harp Amps Blog
The Mile High Blues Society
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Last Edited by Rick Davis on Jul 18, 2013 7:41 PM
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2plankr
41 posts
Jul 19, 2013
8:49 AM
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"Cathode biasing reduces the absolute output power by about 20%-25%"
Does that mean the amp is not putting out a full 15 watts?
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Rick Davis
2135 posts
Jul 19, 2013
9:47 AM
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2plankr, the basic cathode bias Delta Sonic amp makes an honest 15 watts before it clips. I've seen in on the scope.
It makes a little more with fixed bias, and a little more still with the bigger transformers, getting it up to around 22 watts.
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-Little Rick Davis
The Blues Harp Amps Blog
The Mile High Blues Society
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Last Edited by Rick Davis on Jul 19, 2013 9:48 AM
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Rick Davis
2145 posts
Jul 21, 2013
10:59 PM
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I played the Delta Sonic amp tonight in a loud jam set. The amp was lined out to the PA. It sounded good; lots of nice comments about the tone.
I EQ'ed the PA channel with bass boosted and Mids and Highs rolled off. No monitor or effects. No pedals. I'm getting faster at getting the line out set up and the PA adjusted; now it just takes a couple minutes. Tonight I asked the jam host to set the PA volume level on the harp as I played. Then, I turned the amp up one notch to 5. Perfect!
The Delta Sonic is getting to be my regular gig amp. I haven't hauled out the Bassman in a few weeks.
BTW, the jam set I played tonight was kind of a train wreck because the singer had no idea how to lead the band. He didn't count off the beginning, he didn't direct the solos, and he was terrible at leading the ending.
For all you guys who want to sing at jams, you gotta learn to lead the band. It was pretty chaotic.
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-Little Rick Davis
The Blues Harp Amps Blog
The Mile High Blues Society
Tip Jar
Last Edited by Rick Davis on Jul 22, 2013 7:36 AM
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