The "Who Owns the Blues" thread got me thinking of the many (white) rock bands that ripped off bluesmen and got rich in the process. I thought we could compile a list here of the many blues rip offs. I'll start:
Canned Heat's "Goin' up the Country" is a note for note rip off of Henry Thomas' "Bull Doze Blues"
great musicians steal. There is very little that is original these days and most people don't like truly groundbreaking music (ie; how many of you feel about Howard Levy)
---------- "The privilege of a lifetime is being who you are." - Joseph Campbell
Now, is it right that the artists that do cover versions get all the fame, money and glory? Arguable. Hopefully the original artists are still getting royalties, unless their material was mismanaged and/or became public domain. ---------- ~Todd L. Greene, Devout Pedestrian
"listen to what you like for inspiration, but find your own voice"
I think Howard is awesome and is currently the most important harmonica player on the scene. Look at all the young player that are actually accepting the harp as a true musical instrument.
---------- "The privilege of a lifetime is being who you are." - Joseph Campbell
@ Buddha-the same could be said for JR, IMHO. I first heard of Howard thru his Flecktones recordings, and was hooked then. I've only been fortunate to see him live once here in New Orleans at Snug Harbor, which is the equivalent of seeing him in your living room. Great piano and harp work of course, and he was accompanied by Johnny Vidacovich on drums, James Singleton on bass and David Easley on pedal steel-all New Orleans greats. The synergy made for an amazing, unforgettable and in-your-face show.
Back on topic-I don't see bands covering other artists' tunes on recordings as a 'rip-off', unless it's done without permission.
---------- ~Todd L. Greene, Devout Pedestrian
"listen to what you like for inspiration, but find your own voice"
@Philosofy: that's going to be one heck of a long list. When does adapting a tune that one of the band owns a rare recording of, and can't quite remember the words to on stage or in the studio, become a 'ripoff'?
@philosify you are barking up the wrong tree here mate.. your band plays a copy of what someone wrote, you credit it that to them verbally, at the start of the number and thats that, white,black, brown or yellow what is your point, we all steal/borrow licks/songs etc
It's not stealing - it is part of the artform. You don't have to listen to a lot of early Delta blues to hear singers taking whole verses verbatim and inserting them into their own works. The blues has roots in African oral tradition - repeating the words your forebears taught you (and maybe adding a few of your own for posterity). It's just part of blues culture.
There's only so many ways you can put 12 different notes together and make them sound like the blues. Raise your hand if you've put together a truly unique musical thought that can be considered as "blues". I'm guessing there won't be very many hands. Everything I play is in some way inspired by or borrowed from the music I've listened to in my 35 years, whether consciously or not.
I see your original point, which was to recognize the number of records made that are/were blatant plagiarisms. The fact is, it was easier to do that 50+ years ago. It was the nature of the business. You can like that or not, but it's a fact.
One thing I ought to mention is that this has always been going on and race has nothing to do with it... or maybe I just don't think about race when I think this stuff, but Lots of times I've heard Jimmie Rodgers' stuff, the white-brakeman-who-died-of-TB Jimmie Rodgers not one of the other two Jimmie Rodgerses lyrics work their way into other people's songs later. But then, I see notation and some of Rodger's lyrics compiled in some of Alan Lomax's work from the 1930s... maybe the folks stole them from Rodgers, but I don't think so. I think they are much, much older. Everything I've seen points to this dynamic of blues starting off with a pool of lyrics and melodies up in the ether and people plucked off and pieced together whatever felt right.
I'm a HUGE fan of Jimmie Rodgers. HUGE. How did I hear about Jimmie Rodgers? Lynyrd Skynyrd did a copy of of a Rodgers' blues tune, "T For Texas" on their live album in 1976. They said "this is an old tune by Jimmie Rodgers" or something, plus Jimmie had credit in the liner and I think "who was this guy writing about sleeping in hollow logs and shooting his woman for just the hell of it because he's bored or something?" That led me to a major interest in Rodgers and some might notice that I talk about him all the time. That's one of the reasons I consider them covering T For Texas, and they did it nothing like how Rodgers did (they sped it up made it a rock blues) and they gave him due credit.
Led Zeppelin 2... "The Lemon Song" is credited as being written by the Zeps, but it is a total ripoff of Howlin' Wolf's "Killing Floor." As a huge fan of both Zep as well as Wolf, I had to say that I lost a LOT of respect for Led Zeppelin when I first heard that song! Musicians copy, steal, and cover all the time, but I hate when people take credit for stuff they didn't write!!! If I had covered "Killing Floor" I would have CHESTER BURNETTE written in bold print on the writing credits... regardless of whether or not I changed the rhythm a little.
For "Child in Time", Deep Purple "borrowed" from It's a Beautiful Day's "Bombay Calling." In turn, Beautiful Day "borrowed" something (I don't remember what) from Deep Purple.
Duke Ellington commented about "stealing" riffs and tag lines often...from others and himself!
Eric Clapton gets alot of credit for giving proper attribution for original material...even for unrecognizable adaptations.
Before the age of recording, there were many "signature" riffs that were stolen. The most notorious were those of Buddy Bolden, of whom no known recordings exist. Most of the jazz greats borrowed profusely from Bolden's stylings ( including Louis Armstrong ). Freddie Keppard stole from King Oliver and vice versa.
Maybe all music is derivative since the first cavemen started hitting one rock against another!
Heard a song by Louis Myers called "Tribute to the Aces" Reminded me a whole lot of Whammer Jammer. Do not know if there is a history there of Whammer Jammer being adapted from it. Sometimes you just get a tune in your head and at the time you may not even be conscious of where you heard it. Same with writing. you use a phrase because it fit what you wanted to say only to find it was from a famous piece of literature. As one of my professors used to jokingly say "plagiarism is the first art of scholarship."
The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources. Albert Einstein
The seed ye sow, another reaps; The wealth ye find, another keeps; The robes ye weave, another wears; The arms ye forge, another bears. Percy Bysshe Shelley
Steal!--to be sure they may; and egad, serve your best thoughts as gypsies do stolen children, disfigure them to make 'em pass for their own. Richard Brinsley Sheridan
Don't worry about people stealing an idea. If it's original, you will have to ram it down their throats. Howard Aiken
I don't like composers who think. It gets in the way of their plagiarism. Howard Dietz
About the most originality that any writer can hope to achieve honestly is to steal with good judgment. Josh Billings
Art is either plagiarism or revolution. Paul Gauguin
They had their lean books with the fat of others' works. Robert Burton
Take the whole range of imaginative literature, and we are all wholesale borrowers. In every matter that relates to invention, to use, or beauty or form, we are borrowers. Wendell Phillips
Their writings are thoughts stolen from us by anticipation. Alexis Piron
Next o'er his books his eyes began to roll, In pleasing memory of all he stole; How here he sipp'd, how there he plunder'd snug, And suck'd all o'er like an industrious bug. Alexander Pope
We can say nothing but what hath been said . . . Our poets steal from Homer . . . . Our storydressers do as much; he that comes last is commonly best. Robert Burton
Who, to patch up his fame--or fill his purse-- Still pilfers wretched plans, and makes them worse; Like gypsies, lest the stolen brat be known, Defacing first, then claiming for his own. Charles Churchill
Because they commonly make use of treasure found in books, as of other treasure belonging to the dead and hidden underground; for they dispose of both with great secrecy, defacing the shape and image of the one as much as of the other. Sir William Davenant
Perish those who said our good things before we did. Aelius Donatus
When Shakespeare is charges with debts to his authors, Landor replies, "Yet he was more original than his originals. He breathed upon dead bodies and brought them into life." - Ralph Waldo Emerson, Ralph Waldo Emerson
For such kind of borrowing as this, if it be not bettered by the borrower, among good authors is accounted plagiary. John Milton
He liked those literary cooks Who skim the cream of others' books; And ruin half an author's graces By plucking bon-mots from their places. Hannah More
With him most authors steal their works, or buy; Garth did not write his own Dispensary. Alexander Pope
Copy from one, it's plagiarism; copy from two, it's research. John Milton
If you steal from one author it's plagiarism; if you steal from many it's research. Wilson Mizner
I recover my property wherever I find it. Jean Baptiste Poquelin Moliere
Amongst so many borrowed things, am glad if I can steal one, disguising and altering it for some new service. Michael Eyquen de Montaigne
It has come to be practically a sort of rule in literature, that a man, having once shown himself capable of original writing, is entitled thenceforth to steal from the writings of others at discretion. Ralph Waldo Emerson
He that readeth good writers and pickes out their flowres for his own nose, is lyke a foole. Stephen Gosson
When 'Omer smote 'is bloomin' lyre, He'd 'eard men sing by land an' sea; An' what he thought 'e might require, 'E went an' took--the same as me. Rudyard Kipling
My books need no one to accuse or judge you: the page which is yours stands up against you and says, "You are a thief." Marcus Valerius Martial
Generally I think influence is used as a nice word for plagiarism. Gilbert Gottfried
What is originality? Undetected plagiarism. Dean Inge
To copy others is necessary, but to copy oneself is pathetic. Pablo Picasso
Last Edited by on Nov 23, 2009 5:14 PM
Strictly speaking, plagiarism is specifically unacknowledged theft. In research (or any essay) you always acknowledge sources. Lists of quotes always contain some which are not genuine. Adam has already singled out the best one, IMO, because it's profound, not intended purely for the sake of wit.
I must listen to Zep's Lemon Song. If it's the one I think it is, I thought it was Robert Johnson. On the other hand, no, I can't be bothered. ---------- Kinda hot in these rhinos!
