Jehosaphat
311 posts
Oct 08, 2012
7:28 PM
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I normally play with people where it is often hard enough to hear yourself let alone to be aware of any slight mis tunings on my harps,so i tend to sorta forget about them til they go obviously out tune,usually just before they die.
But the other night i sat in with a guy just playing semi acoustc guitar and apart from really enjoying the (lack of) noise level i started to realise that a couple of harps just weren't 'right'.Not way out but enough to make me want to check them the next day.
Sheesh! Up to a half semitone out on some notes.
A bit of a wake up call for me to keep on top of checking my harps.
Just wondering how you guys approach this aspect of maintenance,before you play,afer a session or just when you really notice the bad notes?
Incidently this is the best site(ie the easiest to understand) i have found for laying out the tuning options for positions 1,2 and three,and just general info on the whole tuning business.
The charts are real easy to cut and paste and then save to your 'puter.
http://ohw.se/hca/tuning-theory/
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ElkRiverHarmonicas
1322 posts
Oct 08, 2012
7:42 PM
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I just hear it. I play a lot of chords. You notice them really, really, fast. I also play a lot of octaves. You notice stuff out of tune really, really fast when you play more than one reed at once.
BUT, my harps don't go out of tune that much. I've been playing the same harps for three years. Some, I've had for 12 years. My D chromatic, I have had and played - I do play it often, since I was 14 years old. No reeds out in it, ever.
>insert BBQ Bob Quote about playing softly>
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David
____________________
At the time of his birth, it was widely accepted that no one man could play that much music so well or raise that much hell. He proved them all wrong.
R.I.P. H. Cecil Payne
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dougharps
280 posts
Oct 08, 2012
7:48 PM
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When I gig I always have backup harps. If it doesn't sound right, I switch harps and set aside the questionable harp to check the next day.
Most of the time when it doesn't sound right to me, the guitar needs tuning. I often notice it before the guitar player notices it, but not the really good guitar players.
I don't check tuning unless there seems to be a problem.
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Doug S.
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DukeBerryman
28 posts
Oct 08, 2012
7:49 PM
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Never, but now I'm worried about it. I only play single note, and can hear a big difference in the tunings between two differently tuned harps, for example, Suzuki Promaster vs. Lee Oskar.
But don't know if my individual notes are tuned correctly.
Is it possible to use a guitar tuner or some other device to check?
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STME58
251 posts
Oct 08, 2012
10:30 PM
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I frequently hava a chromatic tuner handy when I practice. It is not so much to check to see if the harp is in tune, but to make sure I am not changing pitch as I play louder or softer, and to try to improve my accuracy in hitting the bent notes right the first time.
I have yet to have a reed change pitch and be able to be tuned. Once it starts to go flat is us usually cracked and if I file it and tune it it will be flat again in a few minutes.
@Jehosaphat, I am curious, were your reeds sharp or flat?Were you able to bring the reeds that were a semitone out back to pitch and have them stay there?
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didjcripey
394 posts
Oct 09, 2012
12:19 AM
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Not often enough, but these days I can tell pretty soon when its out of tune
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Lucky Lester
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HarpNinja
2741 posts
Oct 09, 2012
5:47 AM
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I don't play a lot of chords, but I play a ton of octaves. If they are beating, I know to tune. If I play scales and they sound off, I know to tune. If I play with a band and it sounds out of tune, I know to tune - especially if the harp is tuned to compromise, lol.
One thing to note is that if you play a lot of single notes and are using a compromise tuning or something like 7LI, you will for sure sound out of tune with other instruments at times.
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Mike
OOTB Harmonica Price List
VHT Special 6 Mods
Note Layout Comparisons
Quicksilver Custom Harmonicas
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Jehosaphat
312 posts
Oct 09, 2012
1:15 PM
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@STME When i said half a semitone i used a bit of poetic licence,otherwise know as exagerating ;).The worst offenders were about25 -30 cents out.
Most reeds were flat but a couple of the higher reeds had gone sharp.
I have often sharpened/flattened a reed a semitone when experimenting with tunings.No problems if you are careful
Most of my harps are tuned E/T but i have some set up for playing Dorian so i raise the 3 blow a whole step, had no problems so far.
@Mike
For sure, that is one reason i like to keep mainly to E/T.I don't toungeblock a heavy Chicago style so chords and JI tunings aren't so important to me.
Its all good
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barbequebob
2045 posts
Oct 10, 2012
8:10 AM
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Often times harps can go out of tune from playing with far too much breath force and the vast majority of players who are guilty of this ALSO have a tendency to bend past the floor of the bend, which SEVERELY compounds the situation and that makes thing s 100 times worse because it multiplies the needless amount of stress their putting on the reeds by a ten fold and often times a helluva lot more than that.
Many players who play too hard often have a difficult time controlling the amount of breath moisture and so a big reason for harps going out of tune is the fact that breath moisture AND layers of dead skin dries on the reed, which DOES affect the pitch of the reed, and where it dries affects whether the reed goes flat or sharp. If it dries on the free end, the pitch flattens, and if it is at the riveted end, the pitch sharpens.
Many times rather than retuning the reed, what you should ALWAYS do first is clean the reed using isoporopyl alcohol (preferably 91% by volume) on a lint free paper towel (DO NOT BE A CHEAPSKATE and use a bargain brand because they leave s**tloads of lint, which is NOT what you want to be breathing in) and gently remove it, repeating as necessary, but if it is really thickly settled, you may want to use automotive navel jelly AKA rust remover on a lint free paper towel, applied gently and then rinsed off with a lint free paper towel with just water and then GENTLY pat it dry. Much of the timy you'll find retuning won't be necessary.
Just the slightest difference in breath force will affect the pitch of the reed and that's why harp makers NEVER tune their harps to true A440 because the average player often plays far too hard to do that and so most tune closer to A442 or A443 so that no matter how hard you play, you don't fall below A440. In the hands of a player who plays too hard, a harp tuned to real A440 will often be down to as low as A437, which winds up being close to 50-60 cents flat against a band tuned to true A440.
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
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1847
276 posts
Oct 10, 2012
9:04 AM
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"so that no matter how hard you play, you don't fall below A440"
that is simply not true
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1847
277 posts
Oct 10, 2012
9:28 AM
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to my knowledge the marine band harmonica is the best selling harmonica in the world.
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1847
278 posts
Oct 10, 2012
9:41 AM
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the top plate on a marine band
contains only 3 notes
for example on a C harp
the notes are
C E G
the root the 3 rd and the 5th
if you tune to 442
that means the root and the 5 th are 8 cents sharp
the 3rd note of the scale is typically
tuned 14 cents flat
with zero breath force this note is already 6 cents flat
for the sake of argument
lets use 443
that still puts us 2 cents flat
simple mathmatics
2 cents flat very very few people would even notice
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MP
2502 posts
Oct 10, 2012
2:13 PM
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i rarely have to tune my own harps. they don't need much breath force. an asthmatic could play them.
now, on repairs, i'll find as many reeds gone sharp as reeds gone flat.
Ditto on BBQBobs 91% alcohol, but i don't bother w/paper towels for cleaning.
your wife, your kids, and yourself are an endless source of old T-shirts
just waiting to be turned into lint free cleaning cloths.
the same are great for Vynal records, CDs,DVDs, etc. also great for getting rid of the opaque film that appears on the cover plates of repairs i receive.
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MP
affordable reed replacement and repairs.
"making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time"
click user name [MP] for info-
repair videos on YouTube.
you can reach me via Facebook. Mark Prados
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