I've been going through a lot of researching to find a mic that will work on a rack. I know that the Strnad mic is available--it's the one Jon Gindick uses. It's available at http://www.harpdepot.com/index1.html?309.html&1 .
But then I found another one: the Applied Microphone Technology AMT HR2 Clip On Harmonica Microphone. Found it at: http://pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/product/Applied-Microphone-Technology-AMT-HR2-Clip-On-Harmonica-Microphone?sku=270980 .
Does anybody here use this gear? How is it?
Also--are there any other solutions to getting the harp miked up reasonably well on a rack without having it in the way when you go to sing?
I know Walter and many others just put it on a cheap rack and let it rip--singing and playing harp into a voice mic--I just haven't been able to get the sound I want that way. Yeah, I guess I should just practice more. . .
about a month ago i saw Bobbie Mercy Oliver here in town. he's from austin tx and was visiting a friend here in little rock and ended up at the jam. he played a guitar and also blew harp in a rack- with a bullet mic duct taped to the harp and rack and plugged into an amp. it looked weird but let me tell you, he had it down. harp tone was the best i ever heard from a rack setup and he also sang into the bullet as well. and his vocals were fine as well. not sure what amps he was using but he sure made it work better than anyone i've seen.
Interested in this too as I am also starting to play rack harp.
I was considering the madcat mic and somehow fastening it but I'm torn between that and the Strnad.
I'm now going to go check out the AMT.
Jimi Lee had an article in one of last years HH Mags from SPAH. In it I believe that he mentioned mic'ing the rack. I'll see if I still have it and fill you in on his thing.
Attention all Rack Players: I wanted to share this in case you are not aware of it. Playing on the rack is like learning a new instrument. It is very akward physically compared to what you will be use to holding it in your hands. No matter what rack you buy, and how much you try to modify it, it will never feel right starting out. It takes years to to get it feeling natural on the rack. Then you add guitar, drums, keys, or whatever you are going to do from freeing up your hands. This is another experience like learning a new instrument.
To put a mic on it, is going to add more physical problems. Also if you aren't liking the sounds/tones you are getting acoustically, amplifying them will just make them louder. Most will say- I don't like acoustic harp tone that want to amplify. I understand that, but the cable, mic, or what ever rig you come up with is going to limit you mobility even more. It My advice (35 years of rack playing) is to get use to it first without any kind of mic attached to it. Also don't give up on it too quick. I can't tell you how many people I have met that have tried doing rack harp and quit it, usually quickly, because they can not be near as accomplished out of the gate as they are with it in their hands.
I am just begining to feel like it is in my hands when it is on the rack. You have to learn new ways to make sounds that your hands have done up to this point. Otherwise the sound is pretty much 1 dimensional.
If anyone has any questions, feel free to ask me. There is no sense in being frustrated if you find a way not to be! Walter ---------- walter tore's spontobeat - a real one man band and over 1 million spontaneously created songs and growing. I record about 300 full length cds a year. " No one can control anyone, but anyone can let someone control them"
Thanks Walter. I agree that it is indeed like learning a new instrument and at first is indeed uncomfortable but like most good things, The pain will have to be endured and will ultimately purify the soul.... Wow, how's that for commitment?
I'm using the Hohner rack because I like the quality over off brands and I cannot seem to find anyone who carries the Lee Oskar one. The off brands were cheaper and thinner material, could not tighten properly, did not have any padding around the neck and the springs were poorly mounted.
I am now finding that the Hohner one is short in the risers and I'm having to lean into it quite a bit. May have to make an adjustment there.
Any tips on rack design, fit, adjustments etc is much appreciated.
Amplification is only investigative at the moment. Aniticipating future performance with this. May even decide to just lay it out through the vocal mic. ---------- "Keep it in your mouth" - XHarp
Last Edited by on Apr 07, 2010 7:34 AM
Hi XHarp: I have tried most of the racks. I tried modifications too. I just kept going back to the $8 cheapo rack like dylan, jimmy reed used. I find it moves around easy and is light. I like to be able to feel free of it so to speak.
My experience with the other racks was like yours with the hohner. At first it felt good, but soon my neck was all out of line. I did this with several racks and modifications. This is exaxtly what I am talking about with it taking years to get comfortable with it. Most will quit soon after the point you are at. They will buy some other racks, do more modifications, and keep coming back to the fact it won't feel comfortable like in the hands. This is what brought me back to the cheap one. It allows you to feel like it isn't even on you after awhile. Some of the expensive ones I saw looked like those halos they put on you if you break your neck and back.
Dana Hubbard (out of northern California) patented a glove that fit on a mic stand. I tried it but hated it for the reason that it wouldn't move if I did. The nuts tighten enough for me. Have you tried lock washers? I wish I had a better reccomendation. I have read about guys spending over $100 dollars on ergonomically friendly racks. To me that is like hundred dollar plus custom harps- not needed to get the sounds I want. Good luck and let men know what you come up with! Walter ---------- walter tore's spontobeat - a real one man band and over 1 million spontaneously created songs and growing. I record about 300 full length cds a year. " No one can control anyone, but anyone can let someone control them"
its funny you mentioned 8$ rack i seen Rockin ron has a 8$ rack,if i can ever come up with the money im going to give it a try.Thats all i can afford and was wondering if a 8$ rack would work,I tried a bent coat hanger but it didnt work to good.
Last Edited by on Apr 07, 2010 8:25 AM
bent coat hangers stink. They have no strenght. I put the rack in front of the vocal mic and sing and blow through it. YOu can see it in any of my live or studio videos. The studio mic is a large diaphram condensor, but live it is whatever is there, usually a shure 58 or equivalent. If you blast or play with a sledge hammer drummer, blasting loud band, playing off the mic will never work. That is why when I play with real musicians they have to play very quiet onstage. Unfortunately, that is almost synonomus with playing with highly respected pros and now that I am a part time player, it is something that is no longer available. Walter ---------- walter tore's spontobeat - a real one man band and over 1 million spontaneously created songs and growing. I record about 300 full length cds a year. " No one can control anyone, but anyone can let someone control them"
When I was into playing piano and harp at the same time, I used a shure WM98 awesome little condenser. ---------- "The privilege of a lifetime is being who you are." - Joseph Campbell
When I was into playing piano and harp at the same time, I used a shure WM98 awesome little condenser. ---------- "The privilege of a lifetime is being who you are." - Joseph Campbell
Hey Walter, It feels awkward not holding it of course but not unbearable or by any means wanting me to revert back to the hand alone. I do desire to get this done so I can do more solo work. I'm just in need to do something just for me so I don't have defend my ideas to the band or another player. It's like startin over again. Kinda cool and kinda scary at the same time.
I also thought about the paper clip on a mic stand thing that Madcat showed off in one of his vids but it didn't look to stable or easy to play at all.
Oh well, I'm going to keep at it. I'll let you know how things work out as I progress. ---------- "Keep it in your mouth" - XHarp
Thanks Buddha, I forgot about those shure orchestral based microphones. They'd probaly work quite well if you can get them placed correctly and being a cardoid directional may even prevent other noise.
If I recall, they are intended to be wireless, right? How'd you hook that up?
@Buddha--that WM98 looks like a good, cheap alternative for what I want--did you just duct tape it on? If you tape it on--it seems like it might have a hot-spot where the mic contacts the rack.
@Walter--thank you for coming in on this question. One thing I had never thought of was to sing THROUGH the rack--(or through the harp?). I'll give that a shot in the woodshed. I have always tried to sing to the mic--over the top of the harp--then try to get the harp onto the mic by scrunching the shoulders. This can work when I'm just doing a solo--but not so much for doing fills between words--which requires a very quick shift. If I get the harp in the right position for this, then singing is difficult--and vice-versa. Scrunching the shoulders, of course, also creates tension--which can kill the tone.
I might give the Shure WM mic a try--and sing through the rack--then I wouldn't have to have a voice mic set up--and wouldn't have to carry the stand around!
I tried duct taping my green bullet onto the rack--I just don't seem to be able to make that comfortable enough--although I really like singing through the harp when I use the bullet in hands.
Here is a Cadillac rack--looks like it would be super stable and stay put--but it costs almost $200--
http://www.harponline.de/en_400_031.htm
I've been liking the Harp Handle for a rack--it will adjust to a good angle and the rise is good for my taller dimensions--
http://www.activemusician.com/item--MC.HH-1
Problems with it are: it tends to twist a little, and it doesn't seem to be stable enough to attach any kind of mic at all. Great for just playing acoustic to a mic on the low end of the harp though. . .
@Xharp--I know--I think I'm going to get one--looks like the rack of my dreams. I have had a couple of email exchanges with harponline--Michael Timler--asked about if the Strnad would work--he responds very quickly and took the time to do some real reasearch with the stuff he had on hand--just to answer my questions honestly.
He decided the Strnad should work--but he didn't have one to try it with.
I was impressed with the service--although I've never done business with harponline before. . .
XHarp: I look forward to seeing how you come along with it. You got the drive to it. That is 99% of the puzzle!
Oldwailer: You are welcome! I just sing like the rack isn't there. Here are a couple of examples - better than words.......
---------- walter tore's spontobeat - a real one man band and over 1 million spontaneously created songs and growing. I record about 300 full length cds a year. " No one can control anyone, but anyone can let someone control them"
@Walter--that tip on singing through the harp and rack works! I know you know that--but I'm just updating here. Seems dumb that I never thought of that before--but some of the best lessons are the simple shit. . .
great news oldwailer! With all the information out there today most people tend to go overkill. I get a good hearted laugh out some of the results. I did just like I saw wilbert harrison do. Nothing like in the flesh learning! Walter ---------- walter tore's spontobeat - a real one man band and over 1 million spontaneously created songs and growing. I record about 300 full length cds a year. " No one can control anyone, but anyone can let someone control them"
Just an update on the subject of racks--I finally got one of those cadillac mothers from
http://www.harponline.de/en_400_031.htm
No affiliation here--except for the fact that I paid around $200 dollars for the rack!
To make a long story short--the service was GREAT--the shipping was FAST--clear to the NW US from Germany in about a week.
And the Rack! It surpasses every dream you ever conjured about what a great rack would be like. I think I've had about every one that was ever made--I still have four of them around--the Harponline one is vastly superior to any rack I ever tried.
It is fully adjustable--even the tilt of the harp adjusts. The harp is held rock solid, making the upper end of the harp just as accessible as the low end.
Clipping a new harp into the jaws is a quick simple thing to do.
It is now a joy to play with guitar--the only thing they could improve is if they put a pair of robot hands on it to cup the harp--but that might be cumbersome.
Playing harp with hands free will always be the best sound--but with this baby I'm already a better one-man band than I was before.
I don't know if you've solved your mic problem,but FWIW-I've seen horn players use a tiny mic that clips to the bell. I don't remember seeing any wires,so assume they're wireless to boot.
The mic problem will be solved (I think). Harponline supplied me with some pics of how to adapt the rack to hold a regular mic on it. I have a couple of SM57's I'm working on (as soon as my shop is reconstructed--I just moved).
Good idea, Nasty--I don't really think the pic itself is the answer exactly--but the idea of getting outside the problem and custom building something to fit the situation is brilliant.
I've just been thinking of ways to attach a standard mic--I'll let you know if I come up with something that will work. Thanks for the idea--it got me thinking in a different direction. . .
Old thread. New info. There's a new rack mic for harp, and it has KILLER tone! It's called Rackit! from BlowsMeAway productions. It incorporates the now world-renown Bulletini microphone. Head to the Rackit! web page for lots of pro demo videos and information.
