I'd like to only have one amp for guitar and harp, if possible. Anyone like the KZoo for guitar? I heard a few vids on youtube, might be okay, can't really tell. I wouldn't mind if it sounded raw/lofi for guitar as long as it was a good blues sound.
Princeton Reverb has been mentioned here, I certainly like it for guitar. Hard to believe it's harp friendly with three preamp tubes. Also expensive by my standards.
At least one person here said they use a Blues Jr. for both. I tried a Model I years ago, it didn't seem all that good for harp to me, but maybe Models II and III are different. Or I could be wrong. Like it for guitar.
Had a harp modded VHT, liked it for harp, not for guitar. I've heard some say the stock ones don't sound that good for guitar, either.
Anyone have a Mercury Magnetics modded Champ or Valve Jr. that they use for harp?
Bassman would work but too big and too expensive for me, all told.
I don't play out but I'd like the option if I ever get up the nerve.
Only one is a preamp tube in the Princeton. Others are for reverb, tremolo, and phase inverter, per web info. Harp sounds great through a Princeton, but you are spot on about price. If they were affordable, I would have one despite owning other good amps.
The Blues Jr. sounds fairly good with harp and better with guitar. I know guitar players and also harp players that like that amp and use it to gig.
I don't like it enough to buy one for harp as my other amps sound better to me. But I would add a Princeton if I got a really good deal! ----------
I have a Princeton Reverb, which is a ballsy guitar amp and great harp amp. Doug said it correctly about the preamp. it is more gainy than the non-reverb Princeton but it's still good for harp. I have a 5F1-clone champ. It's not a Mercury magnetics mod (personally I think the price is too steep. I don't doubt the high quality. Mine uses Magnetic Components 'classic tone' transformers.) It's great for harp and guitar. I did have an Epiphone Valve Jr which had an 'alnicomagnet' mod, which was also quite good at doubling up. My Ampeg Jet J12 B I expect will do that job nicely also, when it is back in original configuration.
I've read the same question in a lot of places and never really seen a common response. It seems to me from the feedback to that question the common things are: 1.A valve amp ( purist view maybe but seems the response) 2.A channel with good breakup for harp 3.A channel that is clean for guitar (and that has good breakup when you want it) 4.Ideally a channel that could be clean for vocal mic. Since a lot of harp amps have the amp section setup for great breakup it sort of stops 3&4 being possible. But it seems to me what would be ideal is a valve PA amp - there are a few around from the 70's era . It's sort of why I modified a PA amp. Fender PA100 valve head. Originally very clean and sterile , I have modded it to blackface twin specs in the power amp and phase inverter section - now has nice progressive breakup. Each of the 4 channels and preamp sections I have modified to run lowered different voltages and input impedances. Now it simulates some of the older Sano and Masco amp sounds on ch1 ,ultra high impedance (crystal mic harp). Ch 2 is high impedance moderate breakup (CR mic for harp).Ch 3 is std impedance and moderate breakup (for guitar) and ch4 is std impedanace clean ( guitar or vocal mic although not ideal impedance for some vocal mics) I turned the head into a combo 1x12 + 1 x10 speakers and run it on 6v6 tubes for 50w ...although I could put the 6L6 tubes back in and run it at 100w but can't imagine if I'd ever need to! I have only played with and researched the fender amps but I suspect the other brands would be similar - they all had their roots in the guitar amps. Note that as the 70's progressed the amps got more watts and cleaner - the mid 70's onwards tended more to "ultra linear type"- to name fenders version. These are much harder to modify I understand. Better to stick to sixties / seventies PA amp versions I would think. Maybe others have had a go with PA amps also?
I play harp and guitar in my band (not simultaneously). I take one valve amp to a gig and set it to the edge of breakup. I have an AB pedal, one channel for guitar and one for harp. The harp line feeds into a lone wolf harp tone pedal then into the AB. The harp tone allows me to set my harp level and eq into the amp. I then feed my guitar into an overdrive pedal to set my tone and level for guitar. The out end of the AB goes into a delay pedal then to the amp. We mic up so I don't need a big amp. With this kind of set up there are plenty of different valve/tube amps you can use as the harp tone pedal is great for making a guitar amp suitable for harp. It also means not a lot to carry. My preference would be the Princeton over the Blues Jr for both guitar and harp. Hope this helps.
Hey Bob. Howz it goin bro. (Chris) I still got your VHT. It still sounds great. Haven't done anything else to it yet. Thinking about doing a speaker swap and slightly lower gain tubes. But other than that she's still sounding beautiful.
I'm not really the one to answer this question. But i will say that i had the oportunity to play with one of those quilters for a few days. A guitar player, staying with a friend of mine, had one.
If i had the money i would be all over that amp. It's soooo nice. Sounds warm and breaks up at just the right spots. And you get all the fancy SS stuff too. Best of both worlds For my money its up there on the top of my 'wish'list ----------
I have a Ron Holmes PA head from quite a few years ago that I believe he called the Velvet Glow. Ron (maker of the various Harp Commanders) designed/built this amp with a harp input and a separately voiced guitar input. As far as I know, this is the only amp model with this feature (I also think there were very few of these made).
I have a `68 twin, and I have used it with 2 power tubes pulled.running on only 2 power tubes its not as loud and it works good for guitar and harp,just adjust it for the instrument.
I would think any good 2 channel tube amp would do the trick. Set one chANNEL UP FOR HARP THEN THE OTHER FOR GEETAR. Dam caps lock! My 76 Deluxe Reverb is set up that way as is my 68 Bandmaster. A Bandmaster Reverb head would be great and they go fairly cheep.
That PA 100 of Bugfan's is this to the enth degree and with 6V6's...Sweet
Last Edited by Barley Nectar on Jul 02, 2016 9:56 AM
Wow, more options than I thought, thanks guys! Hey Chris, wzup, glad the VHT is still alive and swell. I'll try to find a Quilter to play, I def like the low weight.
Don't know what your budget is but I can highly recommend the RI '63 Vibroverb. You would need to swap the crap Chinese tubes and swap the reissue oxfords for a pair of Webers. I preferred alnicos. For well over 10 years I recorded and toured the UK and Europe with this amp. I ran the harp through the Normal channel and the guitar through the other. I knew nothing about using anything other than the 12ax7 and suspect it would have been even better with a lower gain preamp tube for the harp. Having said that, feedback was never too much a problem. I was using a 1950 Shure 520.
The guitar sound is great. Very nice reverb and one of the best tremelo effect you will ever hear. It's also not a real common amp and the cosmetics look great.
To top it off, the prices have risen steadily, nothing dramatic but steady. I'm pretty sure they will never loose money even with inflation.
When I left Europe and returned to the States I sold the one I had and bought another one here. My good friend and the best damn guitar player I ever worked with before or since, Jesse "Guitar" Taylor played mine at a rehearsal and loved it so much he wanted one. I sold his two Blues Deluxe for him and bought him a Vibroverb RI. I did the speaker and tube swap for him as well. It was the only amp he used from then until he died.
I sold mine when I got to a point where I really had to have a dedicated harp amp. I bought a Sonny Jr and a '65 Deluxe non-reverb for guitar. I really wish I could have kept the Vibroverb and I if I ever came across another one and had the cash I'd grab it. A really great amp.
A sample of what it sounded like, http://stevepower.us/Clips/Running%20for%20the%20Border.mp3 LSC
Last Edited by LSC on Jul 03, 2016 6:48 PM
I have a 65 Princeton Reverb Reissue, I like it a lot, but feedback has been an issue with both my 1980,s build green bullet which has had a volume control added. Feedback is less and more easily managed with the stock Shure SM 57 that I'm using more and more. I've modded my amp according to a really helpful email from Greg Heumann and his advice to swap out the high gain 12AX7's tubes for 2 12AU7's and the 3rd 12AX7 for a 12AY7 I also bought a Lone Wolf "Mojo Pad" but the replacement valves arrived first and did the job. I think the Mojo Pad would have achieved much the same result but I've yet to swap all the tubes back to the stock 12AX7's and try the amp and mic with the "Mojo Pad" Just thought this may be worth posting so you get some idea of the differing set up with the 65 Princeton Reverb Reissue for harp use as opposed to guitar use. I've still got heaps to learn, but I'm enjoying the journey. I also love my Lone Wolf "Boogieman Pedal" Cheers JG
I'm a fan of using a true 2-channel amp for this purpose, mainly so I can have separate tone and volume settings for each instrument and not have to worry about it during the gig. Prento's use of an A/B pedal along with a Harp Tone pedal for the separate EQ is certainly viable and opens up a lot more amp choices but I'm more of a straight-into-the-amp kinda guy. My challenge is finding an amp that's crunchy enough for my harp but has enough headroom for my guitar (console/lap steel). I'm currently using a vintage '67 Deluxe Reverb and running the harp into the Normal channel with a 12AY7 preamp tube. I've never found a 12" speaker that I like for harp (even the hemp ones)so I built a 2X10 baffle to replace the 12". That works pretty well but I'm thinking that some minor circuit mods to the Normal channel might give me the crunch I'm looking for.
@Barley: Did you do any circuit mods to your Deluxe Reverb? Drop the plate voltage to the preamp tube in the harp channel? Change coupling cap? I'm not averse to trying any changes that don't involve drilling holes.
@Bugfan: I'd love to know the circuit mods you did to your PA100 as well. Would love to see a picture of how you adapted it for a combo cabinet if you get a chance. What's it weigh?
Hoping this is enough on-topic not to be a hijack.
@bilzharp - I can send the full altered schematic but main changes were input resistors changed to std fender values 1m and 68k on ch4 the others channels 8m,5.6m&5.6m all with the 68k. Very easy mod to really open up the amp and reduce the sterile sound of it. I changed the 2 main coupling caps to 0.1uf oil in paper type and the 4 preamp coupling caps to poly type 0.1uf - these all allow way more base thru. I changed the screen resistors on the power tube bases to 1k5 3w - this gives more protection to 6l6 tubes but also lets me run 6v6 tubes safely for more breakup at less watts. I changed the pi section 2 resistors to black face values - this unbalances the pi and then I have found that the 12wd7 tube in the pi unbalances it more again. A sound I like. Lastly I have increased the screen resistors on the preamp valves to lower the operating voltage of those valves ch1 100k to 820k has the valve operating at 90v, ch2 is 560k and CH 3 450k .... All these voltage changes give each channel a different tone... make the sound to a little "browner" for want of a better term. All easy and cheap changes. I am using Russian 6v6 equivalents and biased the amp really low for the sound I like. Speakers are a 12" and a 10" alnico's. I'll see if I can post a pic tomorrow. Weighs 23 kg and I'd a squat thing at about 450mm high.
Bugfan - Thanks so much. Lots of great information there. I have a buddy with a PA100 so I'll have to try some of those mods. A number of the mods look like they'd work for other Fender amps as well. I assume where you said "increased the screen resistors on the preamp valves" you meant plate resistors. Unless that's just an American/British tube/valve sort of thing. I'd still love to see the schematic and a picture if you get a chance. My email address is in my profile if you click on my forum name.
@Bilzharp - emailed info let me know here if you don't get my email. yes plate resistors in preamp changed to copy low voltage preamps like the Sano/Masco type amps as it seems to be a reason for their signature sound. There are a couple of different PA100 versions- the early one (as per mine) just has a master reverb control , the later version has a pull vol on each channel that actuates the reverb for each channel individually - slightly more complicated circuit but I think that version would be better as a double duty amp because you can have reverb on you instrument channels but clean on your voice one. Same mods would all work on it though. Later model again PA series were ultra linear amps , very clean and a whole lot different circuitry and operation - I believe too hard to mod for the basic soldering iron wielder!
