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Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! > Volume control mod for Shure PE535S
Volume control mod for Shure PE535S
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mlefree
660 posts
May 01, 2016
10:19 AM
I know someone has done this but I can't find instructions or a wiring diagram to replace the on/off switch in my Shure PE535S mic' with a volume control.



Known as the "James Cotton mic'" it's a killer mic for harp and can be had very inexpensively. But it lacks the volume control of its far more coveted and hence far more expensive brother, the PE585SAV.

Strangely, even though the ball is larger, there is something about its shape that makes it easier for me to cup with my smallish hands than my SM-58 or my 545S. The 545 sounds great but it's hard for me to cup well and for any extended period of time. So I want to find a cheap mod for my 585 while I am saving up to have Greg "Ultimatize" my 545.

I have a Blows Me Away volume control (VC) but when I attach it the mic' is literally a foot long. Very unwieldy and clumsy to use.

So I am looking at the switch on my 585S and thinking that it couldn't be too difficult to adapt a mini VC potentiometer from a mechanical viewpoint. I am mechanically savvy and have the tools. But, although I can solder well, I am completely iggernant from an electronics design standpoint.

So, I am seeking information if anyone has done this themselves or knows where to find how to do it on the interweb. Though I think all I have to do is disassemble and replace the switch plate, but I want to find out to what extent I have to non-destructively disassemble the mic. I also need the specifics about what kind of pot to use and how to wire it.

Basically I want to put the equivalent of the guts of Greg's VC into the 585. I don't want to destroy my BMA VC and I don't even want to take it apart to reverse engineer it because the connectors are pressed on and that takes special equipment. And although, and maybe because he's a HarpBuddy I also don't want to put Greg in the uncomfortable position of essentially asking him to advise me how to redesign his VC so I can replace it.

I think that I can just replace the existing switch with the VC, wire-for-wire, but I may need to add a resistor to have the right resistance range for the pot. I don't want to experiment or find out the hard way I've done it wrong.

Anyway, this would be an even better harmonica mic' if it had a VC. And, if instructions for how to modify a PE585S were readily available I bet a lot of players on a budget besides me would benefit.

Any help would by much appreciated.

Thanks!

Michelle

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SilverWing Leather - Custom leather creations for musicians and other eccentrics.

Last Edited by mlefree on May 01, 2016 10:23 AM
Killa_Hertz
1251 posts
May 01, 2016
3:28 PM
Its very easy michelle.

Heres a good reference. It will explain all the options you have.

I would just order a potentiometer and put it in there. No need to salvage parts. As for the size of the Pot, I'm not exactly sure. But a 250k i think is a standard for dynamics. Maybe someone else will ring in. But no resistor needed.

I have a 585 also. Haven't used it much. I prefer my dm13, but am planning a similar "surgery" on it.

Well check this out. If you still have questions, I'm glad to help.
Volume Control Reference Courtesy of Lone Wolf Blues Co.



I will look for schematics for the 585 or just tear mine apart to tell you exactly what wires to put where, If you need.

Hopefully someone more versed in mic customizing will ring in.



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Last Edited by Killa_Hertz on May 01, 2016 3:36 PM
Greg Heumann
3220 posts
May 01, 2016
7:25 PM
You may find that there's very little room for a volume pot in there - the switch generally rides directly over the internal transformer. Good luck finding a pot that fits. If one DOES fit, it should be wired between the transformer and the connector.
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***************************************************
/Greg

BlowsMeAway Productions
See my Customer Mics album on Facebook
Bluestate on iTunes
dougharps
1213 posts
May 01, 2016
9:06 PM
Here are spec sheets with wiring noted. 585s use the same elements whether hi-z (585A) or low-z (585B). They are just wired differently, as noted on the spec sheet, Figure 4 and Figure 5.

585SA


585SAV

Here is the Shure discontinued mic page:

Shure discontinued mics

I have 2 585SAVs and one 585SB. I like the 585SAV a lot, and it is my choice for playing through an amp unless I really need the bullet sound specifically.

For better vocals and harp to the PA I like my Ultimate 58.

I once had to solder a broken connection from the transformer to the element. It was tight work in there. Putting in a volume pot could be very difficult and might risk broken connections.

Good luck!
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Doug S.

Last Edited by dougharps on May 01, 2016 9:09 PM
Thievin' Heathen
747 posts
May 01, 2016
9:36 PM
I have a couple of 585's. I like 'em a lot. 1 is an SAV but the volume pot is not quite perfect. A little scratchy and slightly intermittent. So, I set it and play instead of constantly working it. I can shut it down if I have to but I'm seeing the feedback problem a lot less often these days. I have developed a pretty good feeling for what I can get away with. Greg's Ultimate 57 was a big contributor to learning that.
mlefree
661 posts
May 02, 2016
9:26 AM
Thanks, guys. I guess it's time for mouser.com.

I'll let you know if anything positive comes of this.

Michelle

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SilverWing Leather - Custom leather creations for musicians and other eccentrics.
Killa_Hertz
1262 posts
May 02, 2016
9:53 AM
Mouser .... that brings back memories. I used to order all my tinkering stuff from them as a kid.

Michelle .. i guess you will have to be fateful about pot size, but you already know there is a model that comes that way, so maybe find out which type is in the SAV model.
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Harpaholic
891 posts
May 02, 2016
6:29 PM
Bourn makes the only pot I know of that will fit.

The mini Alpha's will not fit, and you will not find a pot like Shure used in the SAV's.
JustFuya
909 posts
May 04, 2016
7:15 PM
Has anyone tried using a linear or sliding pot for volume control. I fully accept that I might be missing something obvious.

The idea came to me while I was thinking about a circuit for a simple & silent LED metronome for use while busking. [Perhaps powered by a watch size battery] Last time out our timing was abysmal yet all goes well when we practice using a visual compterized metronome. I looked for a small, sleek and portable one but all of them have obnoxious knobs or unnecessary features like digital readouts and speakers that we don't require.

I figure there's a good reason that I haven't seen one and would love to know what it is.
dougharps
1219 posts
May 04, 2016
7:46 PM
@JustFuya
I have an EV630 and a Turner lavalier mic that are both high-z and do not have volume controls, but are set up for 1/4" plugs. I have used a guitar cable with a sliding pot on one end as a volume control on these mics. The sliding pot worked OK with those dynamic mics. I even gigged with the EV630 with that cable for a while.

Now I prefer my 585SAV, or Brown Biscuit with a CM element and one of Greg's in-line volume controls. Or on occasion I use my Turner 22X with a ceramic element and one of Greg's in-line volume controls.

But the sliding pot in the guitar cable was OK with the EV630, so I guess one could be used in a mic, too.
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Doug S.
mlefree
663 posts
May 05, 2016
11:38 AM
Justfuya, I thought of that when I saw sliding pots on mouser.com. Bit then I also thought of all the players who, like Jason Ricci, constantly fiddle with rotary pots (probably unwarranted). Unless there is a way to lock the slider, I'd be paranoid about accidentally moving it during a solo or similar terrible moment.

But a nice thought!

Thanks,

Michelle

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SilverWing Leather - Custom leather creations for musicians and other eccentrics.
JustFuya
910 posts
May 05, 2016
4:01 PM
Michelle - Since we are seeking the same thing (for different applications) I'll let you know when I come up with something.

I once asked a brilliant hands-on EE at a workplace if he could repair a disintgrating solenoid for the locking gas cap of an antique car. Sure .... no problem.

Turns out he had to recreate the core and then wound the coil by hand after carefully calculating the specs from the crap pi;e I had handed him. In the end he laughingly informed me that, all things considered, the work, material and labor added up to thousands of dollars. It took a bit of time to square his kindness with some chassis designs after I left the company but we are even now. Had I known I would not have put him through the trouble.

I will not ask him for a part this time but I will ask for his advice. It seems to me that a slider exists or can be modified with some sort of incremental stops.
Greg Heumann
3224 posts
May 06, 2016
7:28 AM
There's no inherent reason a slider can't work. They're exactly the same as a rotary potentiometer but in a linear form. They are more difficult to fit in things like mics as they usually require screw mounting which means good access to both sides - and of course cutting a slot requires some good tools. Finally, the slot leaves a large area for contamination - more vulnerable to a spilled beer......
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***************************************************
/Greg

BlowsMeAway Productions
See my Customer Mics album on Facebook
Bluestate on iTunes

Last Edited by Greg Heumann on May 07, 2016 9:08 AM
joshnat
241 posts
May 06, 2016
10:25 AM
I had a volume pot fitted to a Shure 533SA, which is similar in shape (and maybe construction) to the 585. Dave Wren at harpmicshop.com did it for me and it works well. I eventually found a 533SAV which has a volume knob from the factory, but frankly the modded one works better for me.
JustFuya
911 posts
May 06, 2016
1:55 PM
I have not seen the inside of the 535 but after looking at some of the sliders and sleeping on it I can see the need for some machining as Greg says. I don't know if they have home versions of keyway/broach cutters but, in any case, it seems you would have to be very determined to incorporate a slider.

I can make it work for my metronome because all I need is to gather the few parts and create the smallest housing I can to accomodate them. In the meantime I'm going to purchase one of the many inexpensive alternatives.


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