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Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
Amp/Physics Question
Amp/Physics Question
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nacoran
8672 posts
Sep 09, 2015
1:35 PM
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I've got a solid state amp that I use. It's got two separate gain knobs. From experimenting and reading up on similar amps (it's a Park, which is associated with Marshall) one gain is for a clean channel and the other is a distorted channel. By adjusting the mix of the two you can get various mixes, but it's virtually impossible to get a clean single note to break up and sound dirty. If I catch a little bit of another hole though I can get a great dirty sound. I know that works normally, even acoustically, but the amount of dirt I'm adding in my acoustic tone seems to be disproportionately small. In other words, my acoustic tone goes from clean to a tiny bit dirty but my sound through the amp goes from clean to really dirty.
Ultimately, it's doing what I want, but I'm not understanding the acoustics reasons why it can sound so clean and then with such a little adjustment can it get dirty. If it was a piece of software I'd say it was listening for distorted sounds and then, and only then, applying even more distortion to it, like there was a distortion threshold it was listening for, but a 90's amp isn't that smart. What I'm guessing it is is some sort of artifact from how it's processing two tones? I don't have a tube amp to compare it too, so I don't know if a tube amp reacts the same way.
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Nate
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First Post- May 8, 2009
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barbequebob
3014 posts
Sep 09, 2015
1:58 PM
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With any amp. when you say dirty on a single note, how the note sounds when you're less than 6 feet away from the amp can sound quite different if you're standing 10 or more feet away from the amp and when standing 3 feet away from the amp, you have too much distortion, at a greater distance, the note will sound very muddled and lose definition in a hurry and just how much is also going to depend on the acoustics of the room/stage you're playing in. Also, there is also a such thing as touch sensitivity that should be considered as well.
I'm not fond of solid state amps as a whole because they have a tendency to distort the odd numbered harsh overtones and tubes do the opposite, and the only solid state amp I would ever consider gigging with would be a Quilter, which unlike most solid state amp, retains tube warmth no matter what.
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
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hvyj
2767 posts
Sep 09, 2015
2:26 PM
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This doesn't answer your specific question, but if you want to get a quasi tube amp sound with a ss amp use a phaser pedal. The TC Electronics HELIX is a good choice ($116 on Amazon). Turn the Depth control up to 3 o'clock, set the MIX
control at 9 o'clock, and turn the speed and feedback knobs all the way off. You may need to adjust your attack and oral resonance chamber a little, but it works.
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MindTheGap
659 posts
Sep 10, 2015
12:32 AM
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Nate - The simplistic answer is Intermodulation Distortion (IMD). A single note put through a non-linear (i.e. distorting) amp generates only harmonic distortion, so there's a limit to how rough it can sound. In the extreme, it's likely to be a square wave. Two or more notes give IMD which can generate other non-harmonic frequencies which can give a much more dirty sound.
That's the theory. But since I've started playing amped harp, I've been vexed by the fact that some amps do and some don't give particular sounds, and I think even with single notes. And it's not a golden ears thing either. For all the theory, I can't deny that my tube amp feels and sounds different and until there's another solution I'm doomed to lug the thing about. I've found some pedals that come close.
Bob mentions touch-sensitivity and of course we may be talking about different things, but I've identified something which I'm happy to call 'touch sensitivity' which is how the sound moves between a soft and hard-edged sound as you play softer or harder. Ok this may sound a bit fluffy but playing on this boundary does make the ensemble (breath, harp, mic, amp) feel like an organic instrument, rather than a 'tone generator'.
I've not thought about the effect of distance before, I'll have to try that out too.
BTW for interest, here is the sound of a pure square wave compared to a heavily 'distorted' i.e. clipped single harmonica note, with the start and end of the note removed.
square wave vs harp
Last Edited by MindTheGap on Sep 10, 2015 12:50 AM
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