harpdude61
2055 posts
Jun 30, 2014
8:52 AM
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I'm trying to learn more tongue blocking and have a few questions.
(1) If you are blocking holes 1 and 2, and playing hole 3, and you play a flutter with the 3 hole bent to any degree, does it remain bent when you lift your tongue?
(2) If you play a chord such as draw holes 4,5,6 which is very common in 3rd position, are you blocking holes 1,2,3?
(3)Can you play a melody on the left side while blocking on the right and do flutters, lifts and such?
(4) I know some of you TBers overblow? Can you bend those up and how far?
(5) Do any of you overdraw?
I'm sure I will have more as I explore this world. Just trying to find out what is common and possible.
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www.facebook.com/catfishfryeband
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Frank
4736 posts
Jun 30, 2014
9:55 AM
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I don't don't think there are any MASTER Pro TBers on MBH?
So here goes, you'll have to settle with a harmonica geeks inferior point of view :)
For...(1) IT's a good exercise to strengthen your technique up and since there is a bend and a flutter is involved there is an illusion of a continuous note being heard - though I can't say I ever heard it used in a musical context, though it could be and probably has been?
(2) Yes they are blocked, but not with the tongue
(3) Yes,
(4)-(5) The VAST majority of serious TBers are flat out in your face blues players and over/blow\draw is the furthest thing from their mind :)
Last Edited by Frank on Jun 30, 2014 9:56 AM
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WinslowYerxa
639 posts
Jun 30, 2014
10:03 AM
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1)====
By flutter you mean alternately placing your tongue on the harp and lifting it off in rapid alternation, correct? I ask because tongue flutter has a completely different meaning for flute players, where this term originates.
I call this a hammer because you're hammering your tongue on and of the harp like a piston. This avoids any confusion with the growl-like raspberry-blowing technique that flute players use (and they got there first).
OK, try what you propose in slow motion. The note is bent when your tongue is on the harp and unbends when you remove it.
2)====
If you're playing a chord with three holes in your mouth, why would you need other holes in your mouth as well? Unless I have something planned for those other holes (and I might) then why bother to block?
3)====
Anything you can do on one side you can do on the other. That said, using the left side to play a melody and have the accompanying notes be higher in pitch instead of lower seems to be rarely done.
4) and 5) I'm not especially good at TB overblowing, but I'm starting to find that I can do it or 5 and 6 and also to bend the notes up like I can without my tongue on the harp.
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Winslow
Plunge into the SPAH Experience, August 5-9, 2014
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harpwrench
880 posts
Jun 30, 2014
10:08 AM
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TB has absolutely no negative impact on overblow or overdraw facilitation, nor does it limit how far up they can be bent. You can take that to the bank. There's also no such thing as "directing air" with your embouchure, as has been claimed as an advantage in prior embouchure threads.
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www.spiersharmonicas.com
High performance harmonicas.
Last Edited by harpwrench on Jun 30, 2014 10:30 AM
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Frank
4737 posts
Jun 30, 2014
10:15 AM
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Joe, got to here your TB tone recently on a video with the late Lee Mcbee - Tough as nails Brother :)
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harpwrench
881 posts
Jun 30, 2014
10:17 AM
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Thanks Frank-
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www.spiersharmonicas.com
High performance harmonicas.
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Little roger
3 posts
Jun 30, 2014
11:15 AM
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Hi HD.
Here we go. Hope it helps.
1. Nope. The pressure on the reed is created by the tongue on the harp. If I lift my tongue, the pressure disappears and the bend disappears. Would be interested if anybody can ....
2. I don't play 3-hole chords whilst tongue blocking but will regularly play/bend/punch two holes (eg 3/4 or 4/5) whilst TBing 1/2 or 2/3.
3. Yep.
4. Have been rooted firmly in the blues for so long, I've never got round to it ;-) If I were interested, I'd probably give it a try.
5. No (see 4)
Best
Roger
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The Iceman
1792 posts
Jun 30, 2014
11:20 AM
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1. It's true that the bend disappears, but one can play that note and keep it separate from the chord created by the tongue lift and return to it when the tongue returns to the harmonica. The aural result it a 3 hole inhale first bend with the "chuck" sound of the chord.
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The Iceman
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Little roger
4 posts
Jun 30, 2014
11:24 AM
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What he said.
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timeistight
1601 posts
Jun 30, 2014
11:31 AM
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"There's also no such thing as 'directing air' with your embouchure, as has been claimed as an advantage in prior embouchure threads. "
I'm so glad to read an expert opinion on this. The mythical "air direction" bend or overbend never made any sense to me.
All bends and overbends are caused by manipulating resonance, IMO.
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CarlA
553 posts
Jun 30, 2014
12:01 PM
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"timeistight
1601 posts
Jun 30, 2014
11:31 AM "There's also no such thing as 'directing air' with your embouchure, as has been claimed as an advantage
I'm so glad to read an expert opinion on this. The mythical "air direction" bend or overbend never made any sense to me.
All bends and overbends are caused by manipulating resonance, IMO."
@timesight
There is nothing "mythical" about it! I used to be skeptical too, until I met the "air redirection beast" at the crossroads at midnight in the Mississippi delta. Just look in the mirror and chant the phrase "Oh, mythical creature of the air redirection embouchure, please show yourself true" 3 times in a row and you too will become a believer! I am serious!
Last Edited by CarlA on Jun 30, 2014 12:02 PM
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CarlA
554 posts
Jun 30, 2014
12:07 PM
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But to answer the OP, in my experience from changing to mostly TB from LP, I find that you can do everything TB that I was able to do LP.
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tmf714
2628 posts
Jun 30, 2014
12:18 PM
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Then people wonder why pros rarely contribute here-
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harpdude61
2056 posts
Jun 30, 2014
2:22 PM
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I really appreciate this awesome input! Thank you so much.
I thought (1) was not likely but had to ask.
The reason I asked about the 3 note chord was that some claim to be full time TBers that leave some tongue on the harp no matter what.
I'm sure melody on left tongue on right is rare, but would still love to hear what it sounds like.
The overbends are interesting.
Didn't want to get off topic...but, when I play blow 6 I can feel the airflow running thru the mouth and straight thru the harp. When I overblow, the only thing I change is throat shape and it sure "feels" like the air flows over the roof of my mouth. I will study more before saying I am positive because as I bend the OB up the throat changes shape and the air still flows over the roof of mouth but seems thinner.
Carl, you seem positive that I am wrong. Buddha told me I was a throat player. I will play with this, but why wouldn't reshaping the throat redirect air? AS I sit here I can blow air to either side of my mouth and make that jaw expand.
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www.facebook.com/catfishfryeband
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CarlA
556 posts
Jun 30, 2014
2:53 PM
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@harpdude61
It's just that we are coming up with terms that seem to be anatomically and physiologically impossible.
I know that you have stated to be a "throat bender" in a previous thread. You mention that you don't use your tongue to bend notes, but rather the throat(pharynx). Is this correct?
Because IMO, it seems impossible to bend notes UNLESS your using the tongue to change the airflow through the harp.
I could certainly be wrong, but a simple video demonstration would support my claim, and refute the "throat bending" camps claim
Last Edited by CarlA on Jun 30, 2014 2:56 PM
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