528hemi
387 posts
Aug 23, 2013
1:25 PM
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One amp 12 inch speaker a bit dark for what I perceive to be the perfect tone (12watts) 2 6v6's power tubes
One amp 10 inch speaker a bit bright for what I perceive to be the perfect tone (12Watts) 1 7591 power tube
A/B them both together and WOW. The perfect amp.
I have one amp a multivox combo bass amp (12inch) that actually tonally is very close but of course not as full as the 10 and 12 together.
I need to find an amp that sounds like the 2 combined with about 18 watts in 1 amp.
528hemi
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Martic
30 posts
Aug 25, 2013
12:24 AM
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What about putting a speaker output in your multivox amp and making a cabinet with a 10 and a 12 inch speaker together?
http://s19.photobucket.com/user/dzaneh/media/DSC01566.jpg.html
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528hemi
388 posts
Aug 25, 2013
8:01 AM
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Thanks Martic,
You had to mention that! LOL Now how do I go about choosing the best speaker combination. :) I would probably spend a fortune trying all kinds of combos.
I know custom amp building must go through a lot of R&D to come up with the tone they are looking for or they could choose an all around good speaker and tweak thier circuits.
All in all that Multivox did not shadow the 2 amps played together enough to justify the amount of time and money to match it. I had my wife judging and it was close.
528hemi
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HawkeyeKane
1953 posts
Aug 25, 2013
5:39 PM
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Here's an idea for you to mull over.....
What about installing a typical speaker-driven line out on each amp (ie- the line out circuit Greg installs on his rebuilt Zoo's). It's a good addition to any amp in and of itself really. Then, once that's done, try the bright amp lined into the dark amp, and vice-versa, the dark amp into the bright amp. See what it does for you. I've had a great amount of success lining my Zoo into different amplifiers. My Alamo 2566 Fury, an Ampeg J-20 reissue, a Lectrolab R500, and on one oddball occasion, an SWR Super Redhead just to name a few. It can create interesting gain structures and tone stack combinations. And as I've found, it usually fills most small to medium sized rooms with strong rich tone.
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Hawkeye Kane
Last Edited by HawkeyeKane on Aug 25, 2013 5:40 PM
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chromaticblues
1447 posts
Aug 26, 2013
10:28 AM
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@528hemi What is the amp that is to bright?
It is (most of the time) quit easy to make an amp a little ballsier! Sometimes changing one cap can make the whole thing seem better!
Also it seemd like you want louder.
Your speaker is probably 8 ohms. You could buy two 4 ohm 10 inch speakers and wire them is series to get 8 ohms this would move more air and seem louder.
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528hemi
389 posts
Aug 26, 2013
11:01 AM
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Chromaticblues,
Premier 110. Lots of headroom, reacts nicely and breaks up at high volume. It is a nice amp just abit too bright. The thing is it really cuts through when I am blasting my Stereo. Just trying to see if it can be improved. Might just need a speaker change but since I have other amps not sure how much to tinker. I was thinking maybe just a lonewolf Tone+
Maybe I'll try a fender princeston reverb reissue. :)
528hemi
Last Edited by 528hemi on Aug 26, 2013 11:06 AM
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chromaticblues
1448 posts
Aug 26, 2013
11:24 AM
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I tried to find a schematic for your amp online, but couldn't find one quickly.
It sounds like it is single ended which means it's probably cathode biased. Almost every amp back then used 25uf cap in parallel with the cathode resister. OK by raising this value to 47 or even 100 what happens is the power tube gets more gain and looses some of it's highend! So by increasing to 47 or 100 you would get earlier breakup and have a little less highend at 47 and noticably less at 100.
Also as you said trying a few different speakers is something you'll have to do. Find an amp tech close where you live and explain this him. It's real easy they'll be able to do it in an hour.
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Harpaholic
338 posts
Aug 26, 2013
11:39 AM
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Why not use them both with an ABY pedal?
I use the Radial Big Shot passive model. I highly recommend it, and If I remember right it was under $50
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528hemi
390 posts
Aug 26, 2013
12:10 PM
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Harpaholic,
There really is no reason not to do it except I just sold the darker sounding amp. :)
I had my wife A/B my multivox combo bass amp against the other 2 amps AB'ed together and she liked them both. She could not decide a clear winner although I heard a difference. To me they also both sounded good but the (2 amps with 10" and 12" speaker was fuller as expected) but if I had to rate them one would get a 9 and the other a 10
My Bassman gets an 11 LOL
So this thread is taking a turn now and I will concentrate on tweaking the premier 110.
Again, the lonewolf Tone + might be the answer.
Last Edited by 528hemi on Aug 26, 2013 12:13 PM
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chromaticblues
1449 posts
Aug 27, 2013
6:10 AM
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@528hemi
I looked for a schematic last night, but couldn't find one for your amp. My main concern is that some premier amps had S.S. rectifiers. If your amp does one it will sound brighter and tighter than most amps with tube rectifiers.
Again this all just educated guessing!
I'm just trying to give you some ideas to remedy the situation. If I had that amp I would not get rid of it! Premier's are nice amps!!
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528hemi
391 posts
Aug 27, 2013
6:31 AM
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Thanks Chromaticblues,
I have a schematic curtesy of Mark B. who helped me fix the Mic input. It has a 5y3 Rectifier tube. Only for the right price I would sell this amp. Although it is a bit bright compared to my other amps which have more bottom, This amp is very reactive and has very good tone. It is loud and no feedback issues. The more I think about it, it really only could use more bottom. I could say the same about my Kalamazoo which I sold as my premier 50 with a weber trumped it in my opinion.
2 different sounds, both good but did not need both amps. The thing about it is I am sure this is the way it suppose to sound. Some will love this. I think I am trying to compare all my amps to a Bassman. :)
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HawkeyeKane
1956 posts
Aug 27, 2013
6:45 AM
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"Again, the lonewolf Tone + might be the answer."
"I think I am trying to compare all my amps to a Bassman."
What about trying a Boss FBM-1 '59 Bassman pedal? Granted it's not harp-engineered like the LW, but it is programmed to emulate a Bassman by the best emulation folks in the business.
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Hawkeye Kane
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528hemi
393 posts
Aug 27, 2013
6:58 AM
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Hawkeyekane,
Will have to check out that pedal. first time I am hearing of it. I only really used a BBE two timer delay on occasions.
I like "set it and forget it" A volume and tone knob makes things easy. LOL
Took me awhile to find the right setting for my bassman ( bright channel, normal, jumper channels, Volume interaction, etc.) Of course this alloows to fine tune but hey, a fender champ sounds great, turn up the volume and blow. :)
528hemi
Last Edited by 528hemi on Aug 27, 2013 6:59 AM
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HawkeyeKane
1957 posts
Aug 27, 2013
7:07 AM
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I've been meaning to invest in one myself for some time now. I briefly tried a guys pedal at a gig last year. Didn't really mess with his settings, but I liked what I got out of it regardless.
Boss FBM-1 Fender Bassman Pedal
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Hawkeye Kane
Last Edited by HawkeyeKane on Aug 27, 2013 7:07 AM
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chromaticblues
1450 posts
Aug 27, 2013
7:45 AM
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@528hemi
I think what your hearing is the difference between a 7591 and the more common power tubes.
It might not be possible to get the sound you have in your head out of that power tube (if that makes sense). I just watched a you tube vid on a Premier 50. Sounds like that is very much like your amp.
I think I remember someone saying you can rewire the socket and sub a 6L6 for the 7591?
Not sure about that, that might make your amp more "useable".
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HawkeyeKane
1958 posts
Aug 27, 2013
8:49 AM
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7591's seemed to be a go-to tube of choice for Gibson back in the mid-60's. Some of the Medalists used them, the Kalamazoo Bass 30 used them....makes me wonder why they didn't just make the Reverb 12 (both Gibson AND Kalamazoo) single ended with a 7591 rather than a push-pull EL84 amp.
"I think I remember someone saying you can rewire the socket and sub a 6L6 for the 7591?"
If that is indeed the case, then that Medalist 4/10 I keep hunting for on eBay would probably get that treatment. Pair of 5881's might get one closer to sounding like a Bassman.
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Hawkeye Kane
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