Don't want to pop your balloon, but Sugar Blue does not allow videos of his performances. I would ask him directly first, but the chances are that he will say No. And taking one on the sly would be disrespecting the artist. I would not do it without direct permission.
I've seen him scold a dude that was standing in the middle of the dance floor about 15 feet away taking pictures...He stopped the show in the mddle of a song and asked the guy "what's the matter with you, did'nt your Momma raise you right - then told him to stop flashin off pictures or he'll stop the show...It was a small club mind you and it probally screws up his concentration? You'll have blast though - hope you get good seats!
Last Edited by on Nov 23, 2012 3:15 PM
"Frank 1451 posts Nov 23, 2012 3:13 PM I've seen him scold a dude that was standing in the middle of the dance floor about 15 feet away taking pictures...He stopped the show in the mddle of a song and asked the guy "what's the matter with you, did'nt your Momma raise you right - then told him to stop flashin off pictures or he'll stop the show...It was a small club mind you and it probally screws up his concentration? You'll have blast though - hope you get good seats!"
I would consider it MUCH more disrespectful for a musician to scold an audience member and threaten show cancelation than for a random punter to video a show. He is supposed to be a professional. If it is expressly warned NOT to video a show, he should let security do the dirty work
Last Edited by on Nov 23, 2012 5:13 PM
Yeah, it was rather startling when it happened… the photographer obliged his disgruntled request though - Where's the hell's angles when you need em :O
I have seen Sugar three times over the past 5 years-I video taped all three shows,sitting directly in front of him-I talked to him before and after all three shows-he never said a word about me recording him.
Last Edited by on Nov 23, 2012 5:51 PM
You must be his very favorite fan in the whole world, tmf. Post some of your videos then. Or do you need them for practice?
As for disrespect, it is disrespectful to record when you know the artist doesn't want you to. At Buddy Guy's Legends for instance, unless you have permission, security will remove you from the premises if you won't stop. Sugar Blue usually tells the management ahead of time to stop any recording. Suit yourselves.
Last Edited by on Nov 23, 2012 6:13 PM
my top ten list only has ten people he is right there very close to the top
people with cameras can be irritating if you are going to take a picture get a camera that takes a picture as soon as you push the button get in quick and take the shot
if you are there to see a performance watch the show... not thru the view finder set the camera down put it on a stand
I think you will find that that's the difference between a professional photographer and an amateur! Guess. What I do for a living lol
If I am a concert to see the performer I never take pictures. If it's a 'job' I am mindful that people have paid to get in, but also that the artist is having pictures taken for a reason, usually promotion so I need to do a good job.
I do find it strange that some people have to photograph everything, rather than experience the event!
I've seen several musicians not want their images captured or video of their performances recorded. A lot of people don't like flashes popping off in their face. The last time that I saw Robert Lockwood Jr, he had a no video policy. One time I saw Bo Diddley, he was upset because one guy was shooting photos constantly. Sugar Blue is no fool. Crappy video on YouTube doesn't help a performer. It can hurt them.
Recently, I was having a conversation with a friend who I had shot video of several years ago. The quality of the video was good. The performance was flawless. I was in a unique spot with an unobstructed view of the band. So far, no problem.
The club had a change in people booking bands. The new person was shocked by the performance and the lack of people on the dance floor. He didn't realize that there were certain spots in the bar where you could have an unobstructed view. It almost cost the person a gig.
Now, I rarely shoot video unless I know the people involved. The band, the club owners, etc. I'm hesitant to post stuff, because you never know who is watching.
Back to Sugar Blue. He is bad ass. I hope the show was a good one. He's is a unique stylist and talent.
There is a guy in the "burgh" who is actually FAMOUS for video taping (blues shows) - his style is extremely unique in the way he captures a show and he is known on a first name basis with all the national acts that swing through town...I have a show he did of Rod P. and The Mighty Flyers with Rick Holmstrom on guitar in a small smelly old dirty packed blues bar that is outrageous. His collection is phenomenal and will probably one day be an amazing account of what blues shows were like from the 70's till present day.
Last Edited by on Nov 24, 2012 10:31 AM
I purchased quite a few videos from Jemremy-Kim Wilson was probably one of the best-Jeremy had a good mix of shows on that tape of Kim-with Rusty and Junior on guitar- 1993-94 .
No, that is a different guy Tom...Here he is again this collection seems much more extensive and amazing then the link you showed.HARMONICA VIDEOS
The fella I'm referring to is in Pittsburgh and literally has thousands of tapes that he personally recorded, he actually videos more than just Blues and is known as the "Recorder of Rock N Roll History" He has no website that I'm aware of, and videos can only be purchased by dealing with him one on one and that is no guarantee you'll get a video. BTW, I was at that show of Piazzas that I got from him, it was recorded at the long defunct bar called " The Decade" in the year 1995.
Last Edited by on Nov 24, 2012 2:27 PM
Cool site..it's the same site and guy, it seems there are more videos posted on the link I found after checking him out more. He has vids of the Iceman too!
Last Edited by on Nov 24, 2012 2:37 PM
It was an AMAZING SHOW! I took about 30 minutes of video and then Sugar Blue started to get annoyed with people taking video because there was a few girls who literally WENT UP TO HIS FACE and held a camera. What kind of inconsiderate dumb shit is that?
Later in the show he told me to stop recording and I did. I was kind of scared I thought he was gonna yell at me and call me out infront of everyone lol.
What is the female Bassists name?
His drummer wasn't able to make it across the border, so they have a local dude.
---------- I could be bound by a nutshell and still count myself a king of infinite space
I was at a Robert Cray show and a guy in the front row kept using a flash camera. The bass player got mad, and ran up to him saying "You think you got enough pictures now?" in a VERY angry voice. It was intense but I the guy was out of control with the flashes.
I video taped Sugar Blue recently in Texas (posted on FACEBOOK). I didnt film very much, as I was intent on enjoying his performance. He may not have seen me, but I was in the first row. I had no idea that he did not approve. I would have refrained had I known. I will say that Sugar didn't seem too overly friendly before or after the show. Very stand-offish... I got the impression that he wasn't to friendly with his fans. But man, that guy was awesome. Killer chops.
One point that has almost emerged from this conversation but needs to be underlined is that our contemporary camera-phone culture has basically gone insane. It's one thing to snap a photo of a band. It's a version of the same thing for one blues-crazed guy in an audience to linger in the back and tape the show. But it's something entirely different when half or three quarters of the audience, instead of actually WATCHING the show and participating in it, is instead holding up cameras and videocams and flipcams and whatever else. I've been in that particular firing line, and it is not flattering; it's annoying, puzzling, even infuriating.
Blues music depends, ultimately, on some sort of real connection between audience and performer. It's call-and-response music. When a significant proportion of the audience isn't actually THERE, but is instead treating the performers like material to be harvested for some future moment of enjoyment, passion-filled performers who haven't yet gone insane or insensate, performers who remember what non-insane audiences of actual humans (rather than camera-popping humanoids) felt like, are sometimes offended.
I'd put Sugar Blue in this category. Yes, when he waved the band to a stop and told folks at HCH to put their videocams away, it wasn't fun, but I'm starting to understand where he's coming from. Performers hunger for audiences whom they can rock and ravish. People holding up cameras aren't applauding. They're not dancing. They're probably not even drinking, or making old-fashioned fools out of themselves. They're not fully present. They're sucking the lifeblood out of the performance. Or at least that is how it feels when you're trying to connect with an audience where everybody has at least one eye cocked on the viewfinder rather than you.
Last Edited by on Nov 26, 2012 11:21 AM
It really is a peculiar trend in modern society this need to film everything. I can see Adams frustration in his well written piece above.It can also be very annoying to those of us who are there to experience the show live in the moment not later at home on some(usually) crappy video. Two personal cases in point: A couple of years ago on holiday in the UK my wife and I were at the British Museum .Everytime we were standing in awe in front of some magnificent ancient sculpture we were asked if we could move out of the way so someone could take a photo of their wife,kids ,granny etc standing in front of it.Not one of them actually took the time to just admire or study it.They just moved on to the next photo op.Weird and annoying.
Last year we were on a Whale spotting cruise ,everyman and dog had a camera glued to their face. Suddenly a huge whale breached about a 100 yards off the boat ,hardly anyone but us actually saw it happen because they were all busy filming, a seagull! As my old grandad from Yorkshire used to say "Nowt stranger than folk"
Still photos are fine though. Having seen more than a dozen shows or more, I will still take the camera photos sparingly. Sugar Blue is friendly to everyone. May have caught him on a bad day, we all have them.
Adam's points are well taken, I have never heard it explained quite that way. I'll remember that next time I am on a video taking binge. But then some performers relish the videos, so it's a mixed bag.
It's all a question of context. Most performers don't mind a camera or two. Some don't mind when every single person is holding up a cameraphone. A few are from the pre-camera-video-craze days, when you never videotaped (remember THAT word?) a performance without advance permission. These days the pendulum has swung in the other direction, so most folks just point and shoot without ever worrying for a moment that the performer might dislike this. That is as unwise as assuming that we're still in the 1980s and that advance permission must always be asked, preferably accompanied by cash payment. That is how it used to work. Nobody as recently as 20 years ago would think of filming an act, in any context, without advance permission and without offering payment. When people tried to do that, the performers called them out.
The thing to keep in mind is that a) every performer is different and some DO still come from the old school; and b) context means something. When an entire audience, or most of an audience, is holding up a camera and staring at a viewfinder rather than actually paying attention to the performer, some performers may start to feel used. Not all performers do! Again: every performer is different. But blues fans should not make the mistake of assuming that ALL blues performers want to be confronted by a slew of cameraphones. One has a choice, in such circumstances, of whether to be part of that, or whether, by contrast, to stand up front with NO camera and actually groove to what the performer is doing, right then, in the moment.
With bigger name performers--Sugar Blue is a good example--it probably still makes sense to ask. When you ask, you need to be willing to hear and abide by the answer.
Jehosophat: You're absolutely right about the madness-to-photograph that takes some people over. Photos are wonderful for documenting transitory groupings--the faces of family--but they're quite bad at capturing the magic of specific works of art and vivid landscapes. They often lose the scale. Regardless, memories are precious and if you never give yourself the chance, in the presence of great works of art or fabulous landscapes, to soak them all in, to be fully present in that moment so as to sense yourself in relation to the work or the landscape, you're missing something important. You're missing the thing itself in an effort to capture a representation of the thing.
I still remember the second time I saw William Clarke live. I can put myself right back in the chair, beer in hand, along with the 20-25 people who were still left in the club (Tramps, NYC) when he finally took the stage around midnight. He was RIGHT THERE. He was larger than life. He'd just won a BMA for "Must Be Jelly, Baby" in Memphis and had driven up for this gig. His 4 x 10 amp had some kind of tube reverb tank plugged into it and he got the most amazing, rat-infested deep reverb on the amplified harp that I've ever heard. I had no camera, no videocam. All I had was my huger to absorb the performance, and the vividness of an amazing blues player himself. So I've still got it. We make a mistake when we farm our precious memories out to little devices. They miss stuff that counts.
Last Edited by on Nov 26, 2012 1:50 PM
And how many of those folks taking photos and videos do you think were posting them on Facebook and Twitter and texting with their friends about the great time they were having while also checking their email and reading their friends Facebook and Twitter posts.
Also, I think there are a lot of artists that try to limit the photos and videos for the benefit of the rest of the audience. Very few people hold the camera close and look through a view finder. Most folks hold it up and look at the display. If you’re behind that person you now have to deal with the mini TV in your view.
I personally hate being videoed, but simply because it adds a lot of pressure knowing that if you make a mistake, have an off night, or just say or do something dumb, it's most likely gonna end up on YouTube. I've often said from the microphone, "feel free to video as much as you wish, but please don't post this on YouTube." I'm not sure of Sugar Blue's reasons for not wanting to be videoed, but I can certainly respect one's wishes for requesting such.
At SPAH or at workshops I always especially ask the folks not to post videos of the workshop online, because I feel this is unfair to the folks who paid to attend SPAH, the workshop, etc.
i saw sugar blue a year or so ago. great show. i've been recording shows for years, but always with the performer's permission. in this case, i asked via email in advance, and he said no. so i didn't. no big deal.
:) Wow, thanks Adam - that's very kind of you! HCH was a great event - I had to practice up before playing in front of so many great harp players that were there.
And Frank, thanks man - I enjoy your videos and playing also!
Well....sorry but I'm guilty......got a video of sugar blue on YouTube from HCH 2011....... I was not drinking, disrespectful or in his face......just happened to get some great footage that i felt like sharing and it was a great moment....
Last Edited by on Nov 26, 2012 9:12 PM
Regardless of how we feel personally, this new century is driven by digital devices - privacy is vanishing. Almost anything can be caught on one device or another.
Personally, I enjoy those that capture performers in live situations - from small smoky bars to outdoor concert stages - as they are a valuable archive source. I also enjoy those "human" moments in which performers are off their game or make mistakes. That is the real deal.
Of course, it's always polite to get permission first, but our society seems to have morphed into "Do it now, and if its a problem, apologize later".
Have gotten a lot of excellent live recordings off of internet sites like dimeadozen.org....even found a few Carlos del Junco recorded for German Public Radio shows that are excellent in quality.
Grabbed an amazing live solo Elton John show recorded in the Soviet Union in the 90's, for instance, in which his personal artistry came through much stronger than in his recordings or live shows/band.
Gives different glimpses into the creative artist - more so than what is found in legit recordings.
Of course, all these sites are share sites, so no one is making any $ off others talents. These sites also remove shows if the artist has any qualms about them. ---------- The Iceman
I realize that this thread has gone way off the rails, but into very interesting territory. I've been that guy recording live shows, but I'm not sure I will continue to do it, well, not video anyway. It does ruin the live experience by diverting my attention, and I'm sure the attention of those near me. I do often use my Zoom H2 to record audio at lectures, workshops, and concerts. I can do this without distraction to me or anyone. And I find I listen to those audio recordings much more than I ever watch any of the video I've taken. Of course, I don't distribute the recordings either and I will purchase professional recordings from the performers if they have them too. ----------
