walterharp
951 posts
Oct 08, 2012
3:59 PM
|
We have a running argument in our band about what is considered a cover and what is a standard.. What criteria do you use? Is there really any difference?
|
JInx
314 posts
Oct 08, 2012
4:26 PM
|
I don't know, but a standard is one in group of songs generally recognized as such. A cover can be of any song, standard or not. Just my initial thoughts.
What are your thoughts? What is the debate amongst your bandmates?
----------
Sun, sun, sun
Burn, burn, burn
Soon, soon, soon
Moon, moon, moon
Last Edited by on Oct 08, 2012 4:26 PM
|
Willspear
203 posts
Oct 08, 2012
4:36 PM
|
If it was written by Willie Dixon it is a standard
Everything else is a cover
This may or may not be a sarcastic post.
|
Komuso
75 posts
Oct 08, 2012
5:49 PM
|
I prefer covers vs versions
A cover is close to the original in instrumentation, delivery etc. Easy to do badly, difficult to do very well - I can appreciate the effort but it's not for me.
I'd rather put that energy into a version.
A version is when you take a song and put your own stamp on it. This is also easy to do badly, and difficult to do well - but much more rewarding for musical development imo.
my 2 yen!
----------
Paul Cohen aka Komuso Tokugawa
HarpNinja - Your harmonica Mojo Dojo
Bringing the Boogie to the Bitstream
|
tbang
21 posts
Oct 08, 2012
6:25 PM
|
Willie Dixon…Elmore James works too :)
|
Nisei
11 posts
Oct 08, 2012
7:19 PM
|
I'd say a standard is so commonly played that it's not 'too' associated with any one person or group. Things like St James Infirmary or, honestly, Willie Dixon's stuff, I call standards because everyone's done them and there really isn't one recording that absolutely must be approximated.
A cover feels like "someone else's song". An extreme example is I Will Always Love You (which is originally by Dolly Parton, by the way), which is Whitney's song. NOBODY else sings it without imitating and borrowing from that particular recording.
What's tricky to me is determining when a song has been diffused enough to just belong to everybody. People have been playing 'Juke' for decades, but as a cover I think, not a standard, because it's 'got to' sound at least a little like LW. Somehow, on the other hand, 'Good Morning Little School Girl' is a standard, a blues anthem for anybody to do however they please.
|
Nisei
12 posts
Oct 08, 2012
7:19 PM
|
Last Edited by on Oct 10, 2012 5:39 PM
|
walterharp
953 posts
Oct 09, 2012
6:57 PM
|
Ok,
Stated differently, is there a list of standard blues tunes that, for example, any band that plays backup at blues jams should know..
you know.. Stormy Monday, Man Child, Messing with the Kid etc
then what about Pride and Joy.. that one is "covered" tons but seems like you hear so many people that a pro better be able to follow the changes.
|
boris_plotnikov
785 posts
Oct 09, 2012
11:00 PM
|
All standarts are covers anyway.
But not all covers are standarts.
I agree with Nisei, that cover is more associated with one band. Standart can be more associated with another band, than with author e.g. Chicken is Pee Wee Ellis tune, while mostly recognized as played be Jaco Pastorious big band. It's definitely standart.
----------
Excuse my bad English. Click on my photo or my username for my music.
|
Martin
147 posts
Oct 10, 2012
4:48 AM
|
Of course there´s no formal distinction but isn´t the term "standard" often used as a reference to the "Great American Songbook" (which in no way means that non-American tunes can´t be standards: e.g. "My man", "Autumn leaves" -- French tunes that´s been incorporated) and generally this denotes a group of songs used primarily in jazz? Time tested songs, the backbone of which comes from the 20´s, 30´s and 40´s. Younger stuff can then be transferred to the standard category when they´ve been covered "enough" times ... Blues tunes can of course be included ("Stormy monday", St Louis blues")
If asked, "What do you play?", and the answer is, "Oh, we play mostly standards" I´d say that this is what´s referenced to in the strong majority usage of that word.
|
smwoerner
129 posts
Oct 10, 2012
11:10 AM
|
For me a standard is a well known song that any musician claiming to be proficient in a genre should be able to play in a form resembling the original. A standard is a song the general audience will know and will want to feel comfortable with…think Mojo. You can take some liberties with a standard but, not so many as to throw off the audience.
Have you ever seen a band start to play a standard and watch folks on the dance floor start doing their thing and then stop in confusion when the band takes the song in a completely unexpected direction?
It’s like being at a jam and having someone call out Key to the Highway and then play it as a 12 bar blues…
I’d say cover is a broad term that just acknowledges that you’re doing a version of someone else’s song. You can cover a standard but, you better let the audience know that it’s your version of the song at the start…especially if it starts very similar to the original.
Then I guess there is tribute which is when the goal is to do a cover as close to the original as possible.
|
