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Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
harmonica einstein's tuning table
harmonica einstein's tuning table
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belfast_harper
321 posts
Sep 16, 2012
2:51 PM
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I bought one of these tuning tables and it was cheap and it looks like it might make the job of tuning a little easier.
http://tuningtable.com/
On the tuning table there are 3 tunings, original, alt 1 and alt 2.
The original tuning seems to be a version of just intonation, and the other 2 seem to be sharper versions of this.
They are the top 3 tunings on the instruction page.
http://tuningtable.com/instructions.html
Should I stick to the original tuning or are there any advantages of the alt tunings?
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barbequebob
2030 posts
Sep 17, 2012
8:17 AM
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Looking at the instructions and the tunings listed, Alt 1 & 2 I've never runa across that one at all. The first tuning listed is the way all diatonic harmonicas used to be tuned, which the correct listing is known as 7 Limit Just Intonation, a tuning that Hohner totally abandoned in 1985, when they went to 19 Limit Just Intonation, and the only difference between those two is where 5 & 9 draw is tuned. On 7LJI, 5 & 9 draw is listed as 27 cents flat (tho more often, it's really 31 cents flat), wheras 19LJI has those two notes tuned 1.5 cents sharp.
The comprimised tuning they listed is how the MB/SP20/MBD are presently tuned since 1992, and the MS series is correctly listed listed, but the MS Blue Midnight has a totally different tuning (which I'e yet to get a chance to get info from Hohner or figure it out yet).
Now since the list doesn't tell you if they're basing everything from A440, that makes things kind of a head scratcher and no harp in the world is tuned to true A440 because the average player plays far too hard to actually play it that way, and that's why standard pitch is generally around A442-A443, with some harps tuned at A441 and some as high as A444 (tho in the 80's, I ran across some higher key Hohners tuned as high as A4460.
Some of those tunings may be for someone who plays really hard and the harder the breath force, the flatter the pitch gets and most players have just about ZERO control over their breath force.
There are many different versions of just intonation that have been used on musical instruments over the years and a good place to find them is at a site called http://www.justintonation.net. On Google, there are many different links about just intonation you may want to check out.
For diatonic harmonicas, the two most frequently used have been 7LJI and 19LJI with very few using 5LJI (and I have yet to personally come across one with this tuning).
If you want the sound of the way diatonics used to be tuned with the rich, lush chords that are fully in tune with itself, 7LJI may be your choice, which is what was the stock tuning of harps for generations, and prior to 1985 for Hohners, this is what you hear the vast majority of the harp greats using on blues, country, folk, etc., tho it isn't so great past 3rd position, wheras 19LJI is a more versatile.
Remember, different tuning have advantages as well as disadvantages so there is no such thing as a perfect tuning for everything and harmonica reeds give off so many harmonic overtones that can at times makes things complicated. ET is great for single note playing but are horrible for chords on a harmonica unless you have windsaver valves, which also dampens the upper odd number overtones and mellows the harshness of an ET tuned harp chord quite a bit.
You really need to understand your own playing wants and needs FIRST before deciding which way to go.
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
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Todd Parrott
1037 posts
Sep 17, 2012
10:10 AM
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I picked up one of these at SPAH. Works great, prevents accidents and saves time on tuning the blow reeds, but for the draw reeds I find it easier to just use a feeler gage.
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1847
213 posts
Sep 17, 2012
11:24 AM
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sorry not buying the breath force argument
the 3 rd note of a scale determines if a scale
is major or minor
if you tune a harmonica to 440
that note is 14 cents flat
if you tune to just intonation the
five hole draw is 27 cent flat
that is way flat it is completely
out of tune with everyone else
by bringing the pitch up to 443
the 3 rd note of the scale is now just 2 cents flat
within tolerance
the five draw is now 15 cents flat
that is still a problem
so now you have the top plate tuned to just intonation
the biggest problem is
the pesky 5 draw
personalty i like to get that close as i can to 0
i play 80 percent single notes
15 per cent octaves
and maybe 5 percent chords
not an issue for me
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belfast_harper
323 posts
Sep 18, 2012
2:29 AM
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Thanks for the reply barbequebob, I was thinking that the alt tunings might be for harder players as well.
I think I will stick to the just intonation for now as I play mostly in 2nd position (although I am working on 1st, 3rd and 5th) and I am a 100% tongue block player. I like to make use of flutters, splits, pulls, slaps, chords, partial double stops ect, and I assume that the just tuning will work best with that.
Will I be able to get away with the just intonation for 5 position, or should I keep a few harps with a compromised tuning for 5th position work?
Todd, I haven't used my tuning table yet but I like the idea of been able to tune the blow reeds with out taking the reed plates of the comb. It makes like a lot easier when the harmonica is nailed together.
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barbequebob
2031 posts
Sep 18, 2012
8:04 AM
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I wouldn't use 7LJI past 3rd position at all, but 19LJI for playing past 3rd would be a better choice or even the compromise tuning for that matter. The compromise tunings listed are the ones Hohner uses and there are many more versions in use by other manufacturers.
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
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